Grengarm

@canex502 Seriously, when will they learn?

Aside from the first six months of the game, Blizzard's content cycles have always been ludicrously slow. It's really appalling when you look at the numbers. As a WoW player, it's the #1 reason I've always hoped that another company would actually compete with them -- so they'd actually be forced to put stuff out quicker. But so far no one has been up to the task.

@Vgk Ha! A pretty good example. I mean sure, there's only so much design space for a warrior-type character in an MMO, but some of these abilities are literally the exact same thing.

Meanwhile, it's pretty shocking to see how bent out of shape people get when anyone accuses TOR of being a WoW clone. You can't deny there are many, many similar or identical elements.

People act like it has to be this way, that anyone designing an MMO these days has to follow the same script and Bioware would be stupid not to. If that's really the state of MMOs these days then it's a sad time indeed for fans of the genre.

@ReekuMF Didn't get enough bites the first time you posted this exact same trolling comment?

"It's both the freshness of SWTOR's launch and the fact that MMO fans have been going nuts over this game for years that combine to make this our Game of the Year."

I'm all for awarding worthy games, but to equate hype with worthiness is missing the point a bit.

@Jenks How on Earth did you arrive at that conclusion from what I wrote? Of course those games weren't going to be huge, and neither is TOR. That's my whole point.

@(Unverified)

Voiceover
Cutscenes
^WoW has both, granted in far less abundance.

Story
^Plenty of story in WoW if you bother to read it

Class Quests
^WoW has always had class quests up to and including the rogue-only legendary dagger quests in the latest patch. Not in the same abundance as TOR however.

No Level Bracket Warzones
^Which are a terrible idea according to everything I've read about them

Actual Talent Trees
^Directly ripped off from WoW circa 2005

Advanced Classes
^AKA permanent specs, a huge step backward

Companions
^Just makes every class a pet class AKA hunter/warlock

Weather Effects
^LOL c'mon. WoW has had weather for years.

Moddable Gear
^In WoW you can customize gear through gems, enchants, and reforging, not to mention change its appearance

Crafting With Companions
^I'll give you this one. One of TOR's only innovations.

Difficult Heroic Quests (where you can die!)
^I agree it's nice to have some challenge when you level.

Datacrons
^Not something that's in WoW but it's hardly an original idea.

Titles at Low Levels
^Giving them out at low levels doesn't make them a different concept.

Spaceships/Player Housing
^Each class has the same ship. I'd rather have no housing than lame, soulless housing.

Bind Points/Quick Travel (to multiple spots)
^A nice improvement over WoW's hearthstone, but the same fundamental concept

AOE Looting
^Another nice improvement, but why do we still have to click on corpses in these games at all?

Fighting More Than One Mob at a Time
^Pretty sure you do this in WoW sometimes, too :P

Legacy Surnames/Titles
^Something WoW should emulate when they add cross-character achievements in the next expansion.

Story Chapters (provides a sense of completion)
^AKA zones

Commendation Gear & Mods for Each Planet
^AKA badges/points/chef's awards/marks of the world tree/darkmoon prize tickets

No Sparkle Ponies (yet)
^Give it time

You can deny it all you want, but TOR's gameplay, combat, actual questing, and class design is fundamentally the same as WoW. It's blatantly obvious to anyone who has played both games.

Just like Bioware's insanely self-aggrandizing press release, this discussion is premature.

Warhammer Insider, Aion Insider, Age of Conan Insider, DCUO Insider, etc. would have been miserable failures. Let the dust settle.

@KvanCetre Don't bother, Kvan. Wilus chimes in with the same silly argument in every TOR post whenever he sees the word "clone."

I'm not angry about TOR, but I am actively hoping it will fail. It's either cynical or cowardly game design, depending on how they went about making their decisions. What I mean by that is, they either decided that we as consumers can't handle any significant deviation from the standard MMO formula, or they decided they couldn't possibly risk any significant deviation. So, they've given us the exact same gameplay, talent trees, and quests from the last seven years of MMOs, minus autoattack.

I can only imagine that TOR's success will herald another five years of MMO stagnation. Anyone giving Bioware their money right now is voting for the opposite of innovation. In a way it IS personal, JonBuck, because personally I want to see MMOs evolve beyond the tired tropes that we've been mired in for so long. But like I said, I'm not angry. Just disappointed and concerned about the future of the genre.