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Reader Comments (46)

Posted: Mar 4th 2012 9:03PM Bramen said

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This is great news!

Posted: Mar 4th 2012 9:06PM (Unverified) said

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i actually am excited for this

Posted: Mar 4th 2012 9:41PM Glyph said

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He contradicted himself. If you can pay to save time you ARE getting an unfair advantage over others. CCP logic strikes again!

Posted: Mar 4th 2012 10:01PM Zyrusticae said

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@Glyph

I disagree, true "pay to win" is when you MUST pay in order to even be competitive with other players. When the item shop has items that cannot be acquired legitimately in-game, THAT is pay-to-win.

DUST's system, on the other hand, assuming it works like EVE's, requires you to sell PLEX on the in-game market first, in exchange for ISK that you can buy items with. In other words, it is literally impossible for you to buy anything that a regular player who forgoes payment cannot with enough investment in time.

And let's be fair, here - some players are time-rich but money-poor (two things that tend to correlate, I might add, but I digress), while some players are money-rich but time-poor. F2P games are the ONLY games that cater to the latter, for whatever reason, and not tapping that latent pile of money is a mistake on the part of any developer.

People need to understand the difference between a proper "F2P" game (which is ONLY free to *play*, they don't promise anything else with that moniker), and a P2W game. The two are conflated way too often, and that just serves to reduce the credibility of those who argue in that vein.
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Posted: Mar 4th 2012 10:04PM Maseno said

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@Glyph

This is the core of F2P games. Invest your time to achieve something or invest money. It is at the heart of every f2p game out there.
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Posted: Mar 4th 2012 11:09PM Azaetos said

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@Zyrusticae
That's right I would have absolutely no advantage if I dropped $100 for the best gear as soon as the game is released whilst the other guy spends the next few months gearing up for free. No, no, definately no advantage at all.

I am so sick of reading this 'it's not P2W if you can get it in game' BS, if it incurred no advantage then no one would buy the shit!!!

And I always find amusing when I see developers sprouting the 'but you can get it in game' BS, yeah with a 0.00001% chance usually or that will be 100+ hours of grinding thank you very much.

Sorry mate, buy you need to go back and re-evaluate what P2W really means. As soon as there are cash shop items that affect gameplay, then that's an advantage.
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Posted: Mar 4th 2012 11:55PM MajorPorpoise said

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@Azaetos

Just to make sure we're all aware, DUST will have a skill queue system just like EVE, so if you're dropping $100 on the best gear right off the bat, you're an idiot because you also can't use it.

Besides, look at EVE's character bizarre. Idiots buy some of the most skilled characters in the game to circumvent training and player skill - they also die immediately after, and that's in a game where all you do is press F1 once and go make popcorn. If people think buying the best gear in the game is going to save their asses in a much more true-skill oriented game like DUST, then, well... I dunno. I figure they'll probably die too.

Just my two cents.
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Posted: Mar 5th 2012 10:49AM fallwind said

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@Azaetos "That's right I would have absolutely no advantage if I dropped $100 for the best gear as soon as the game is released whilst the other guy spends the next few months gearing up for free. No, no, definately no advantage at all."


and some guy who plays 50h a week has an advantage over me who can only play 10h a week. I demand that their progress be slowed to the same rate as mine!

./sarcasm
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Posted: Mar 5th 2012 8:36PM Azaetos said

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@MajorPorpoise
No the idiot would be the person who didn't look at my post as to what defines P2W where advantages are incurred through cash shop purchases. If there was absolutely no advantage given, then no-one would purchase anything from a games cash shop, that is my point.

By the way your point of purchasing a character in EVE is irrelevant because if I purchased a 6 year old character in EVE for example, then it sure as hell will not take me 6 years to work out how to use it effectively.

There's your two cents right back at yah :)
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Posted: Mar 4th 2012 9:44PM drunkingamebar said

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I wonder how much it will cost to be a winner...

Posted: Mar 4th 2012 9:45PM Alex Oglitchkin said

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Still sounds really fishy to me. Sony isn't the type to just do things for free so I am guessing it will be not hosted on their servers to download.

Posted: Mar 4th 2012 10:00PM Braiks said

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@Alex Oglitchkin Ever heard of demos? You download them for free on PSN.
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Posted: Mar 4th 2012 10:16PM Ebaon said

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@Alex Oglitchkin

I think that Sony is getting something else rather than money from this, something that is, potentially, better: respect.

The PS3 has no real difference when it comes to their rival, the Xbox. There are hardware differences, sure, but largely speaking, there isn't anything that really makes a huge difference. I think many people would choose a console based on their friends more than anything.

But what the Playstation does have is that, for some reason, is the capability for larger population matches and their Playstation Network is free while Xbox Live costs money every month or year. MAG got a lot of media play about having such huge matches - only possible on the Playstation - and it was a good idea, but failed to truly win a big battle for Playstation. If DUST 514 does well, as a Playstation exclusive, it earns Sony bragging rights and gives them a leg up.

I think that's the real prize for DUST 514 to be on their side and be free to play and download.
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Posted: Mar 4th 2012 10:22PM Baby Choo Choo said

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@Alex Oglitchkin

What? You are aware that you can play any online multiplayer game on PS3 FOR FREE right? No fees. Just throw the game in and play.

Also, you have PSN+ which is quite literally one of thee best deals in gaming if you're a heavy PS3 user. Sure, it's $50 but when you're getting free games and big discounts every month, it can pay for tiself within 3-4 months at the most...
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Posted: Mar 4th 2012 10:48PM Alex Oglitchkin said

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@Baby Choo Choo I'm more concerned how it costs companies money to put patches and fixes into a game. My friend works for EA in the Fifa area and patches cost them money on both Xbox and PS3. It is an MMO afterall and people are good at finding bugs to abuse. Free to play also could bring out the people many want to avoid. Every MMO I have played on a console either had a sub or some kind of snag to it.
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Posted: Mar 5th 2012 2:35AM Baby Choo Choo said

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@Alex Oglitchkin

Ah ok, my mistake.Well, as far as downloads goes, like all things on PSN/SEN, it will be hosted on Sony's servers, but when it comes to actually playing the game, servers could be either hosted by CCP or Sony. Since 514 ties into Eve though, I'm assuming CCP will host the actual gameplay servers, but Sony will host the initial download.

Yeah, and as far as the whole patching thing goes, that's something I always found weird with consoles. When developers have a patch, it has to go through certification and all that junk and meet all these bs requirements and THEN they can pass it onto the users. It's really weird when you compare it to a PC game where developers can just release patches on their own. All expenses related to this will probably be coming out of CCP's pocket though. I'm not entirely sure of the relationship they have with Sony, but I'm assuming (like really assuming because I literally have nothing to back this up lol) since this is a PS3 exclusive and CCP and Sony seem to be on good terms, maybe they'll reach an agreement that will be more beneficial to CCP and the 514 community.

"Free to play also could bring out the people many want to avoid."

I'm totally with you on that one, but it comes with the territory I suppose. Most online games, f2p or not, console or pc, are full of sucky people so I guess we just have to deal with it.

In a completely unrelated note, I REALLY hope this game does really well just for the sole purpose of shutting up the doomsayers. I mean good lord, it's human nature to be skeptical, but reading video game forums (not just on Massively) makes it seem like there's always a huge segment of people who want any given game to tank just so they can say "I told you so."
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Posted: Mar 4th 2012 10:03PM Maseno said

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Wow... I wonder how this is going to play out with the Eve universe seeing that they are tied together.

Posted: Mar 4th 2012 11:17PM smg77 said

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@Maseno

CCP hasn't figured that part out yet.
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Posted: Mar 5th 2012 10:55AM ApathyCurve said

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@smg77

They haven't figure it out yet because it won't. DUST 514 will fall on its face and die within a year of release, because the entire concept is just an ill-conceived, half-baked plan to get their paws on some of that shiny, tasty console cash. The speed and totality of the failure will be breathtaking to behold, I'll give them that much.

Maybe CCP should IPO; at least then some cooler heads would step in and demand a coherent plan instead of the usual hand-waving and monkeys-on-typewriters. Remember the five year "development" of WIS? Yeah...
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Posted: Mar 4th 2012 10:25PM (Unverified) said

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Any game that involves providing payment information through Sony or any Sony product is not one I'll be participating in, F2P or not. Just too much of a risk.

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