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Reader Comments (26)

Posted: Feb 15th 2012 6:39PM Maseno said

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Developers shouldn't release "features" that they want to have in the game when the game most likely isn't even off paper yet. I have seen a lot of talk from devs about their games having this and that, and when release rolls around those awesome features are either no where to be found or horribly integrated.

Posted: Feb 15th 2012 7:10PM jealouspirate said

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@Maseno

I agree, it seems way too early in development to believe they have anything but good intentions.
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Posted: Feb 16th 2012 4:22AM (Unverified) said

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@Maseno Actually developers should be planning for features (although I guess we enter a bit of semantics here), if they have a nice upfront list of features they can prioritise them and create a software architecture to support the intended features (not necessaries implementing them all in one go). Software quality degrades the more you hack at it, and making changes to the architectures (a new feature isn't just a few lines of code) later on in the project becomes expensive and difficult.
Now mind you Agile Manifesto included (which isn't all that relevant to games I'm afraid), you can't know what you can or can't do until you get there but it's still a good idea to have some idea of what you want.
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Posted: Feb 16th 2012 12:08PM Maseno said

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@(Unverified)

Planning, yes. Posting what their features will be before the game is even out of the concept stage, no.

Too many companies make the mistake of putting out these massive and innovative feature lists only to have a fraction of them with most not even working correctly at release.
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Posted: Feb 15th 2012 6:39PM Konataismine said

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I'm keeping my eye on this, as it seems to be doing a lot of what ArcheAge is doing, and who knows when that will come to the west? Plus, I like Pathfinder.

Posted: Feb 15th 2012 6:59PM Dunraven said

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Betting this game will never see the light of day.

Posted: Feb 15th 2012 7:03PM (Unverified) said

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@Dunraven : could be right, but at least it has talent behind it with solid CVs (both on the technical and managerial fronts).
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Posted: Feb 15th 2012 7:49PM Khal said

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@Dunraven

I'll take that bet. Especially considering, as noted above, the talent behind this game so has has shipped AAA titles previously. Couple that with Paizo's (the parent company of Goblinworks) reputation for being one of the last bastions for old school gamer type play...yeah, I'll take that bet.

That said, solo gamers have been warned: this is a grouping game, enter at your own risk. Themepark gamers "who don't have the time" to play a game "that is like a job" need not apply as well. Until proven wrong, the thing I love about Paizo/Goblinworks is they stick to their guns about things like the above.

#MMOsalvationatlast
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Posted: Feb 15th 2012 8:01PM Konataismine said

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@Khal Yeah, this I'll be a niche game for sure, but I honestly don't WANT it to be mainstream. I'd rather have a small, but dedicated fanbase than the WoW community any day.
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Posted: Feb 15th 2012 8:02PM mattaui said

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I love Pathfinder, and I really want this to work. But based on the increasingly fanciful ideas I've seen come out of this project, I have to wonder how seriously they've considered the technical and systemic hurdles of something like this.

I guess the closest thing to compare this to would be EVE Online and how player-run corps control parts of low sec space?

Posted: Feb 16th 2012 7:36AM Ozewa said

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@mattaui

"Increasingly fanciful"

I'm sorry, all they did was add another layer of depth onto standard MMO mechanics. Their core concepts seem fairly solid. Plus I like dungeons and adventure.

That and it really isn't any more complicated than a game like say... Dark Cloud.

I'm not saying that the game couldn't turn out to be terrible and atrocious, but the ideas they are putting forth aren't too much more complicated than Darkfall or Eve Online which have proven to have some degree of success. Why not marry the concepts of those games with a more traditional MMO mechanic (kill mob, get loot)

My only questions about it are A: When and how do I start beta (alpha) testing it, and am I going to be able to get bags big enough to hold all my loot?
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Posted: Feb 15th 2012 8:26PM Spacegrass said

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@(Unverified)

Exactly what does tab targeting have to do with homosexuality?

Posted: Feb 15th 2012 8:34PM Malagarr said

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Very discouraging.

Pathfinder, like D&D, has always been about small groups of heroes. Armies, merc corps, etc, are all made up of low level henchmen/followers. If Pathfinder tries to cater to any groups larger than six or so players it will drive away most of its player base.

Soloing should be discouraged, or extremely difficult. That's fine. But raids? Bad move.

I hope that isn't the direction they take.

Posted: Feb 15th 2012 9:47PM (Unverified) said

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@Malagarr : it sounds like you're replying to Massively's summary, not the actual blog post. I don't think the summary is entirely accurate.

They did say "we haven't picked an upper limit, but expect it to be only a couple of dozen characters at most" when talking about parties, but that appeared to be in the context of "parties" doing several different things at the same time, such as..

* Parties may form to go harvest resources: some members will extract the resource while others patrol and fight off hazards that appear

or

* Parties could also be a caravan, with some members moving large quantities of goods from place to place, and some acting as guards to protect the group from hazards and brigands.

..not just 23 people whaling on a raid boss while the 24th tanks.
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Posted: Feb 16th 2012 9:36AM Malagarr said

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@(Unverified)

That sill sounds eerily like raiding to me. When was the last time you had a PF/D&D group of more than 5-6 players, total? My current gaming group is the largest I think I've ever played in and it has 9 players (8 PCs + 1 GM). When they start talking "a couple dozen", they worry me.

If their goal is simple a large scale sandbox MMO, fine. But that's not really Pathfinder. If we end up with everyone being level 20 six weeks from launch what's the point in it?

Personally, when they started talking sandbox, I was hoping for user created dungeons with item and XP rewards determined by the game engine. Player crafted housing is fine, but there is so much potential for a Pathfinder MMO. If it settles in on letting "a couple dozen" players group together to go on a quest together it's only one step away from making difficult mobs (like dragons) raid level encounters. And if leveling is too fast, that is exactly what will happen.

I REALLY HOPE I am reading too much into this. =)
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Posted: Feb 15th 2012 9:13PM Donau said

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Fantasy Eve Online type pvp/sov warfare?

Yes please

Posted: Feb 15th 2012 9:42PM Valdur said

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Definitely yes for this type of game because I'm so fed up with those single player with co-op being labelled as MMORPG.I have been following their blogs for quite some time now and I hope that they succeed.

Posted: Feb 15th 2012 9:59PM oxlar said

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Well this game is dead anyways until they ditch their free for all pvp griefing system they plan to go with. So anything else they say beyond that simply doesn't matter. Fix the open pvp grief system and then I'll take this game seriously.

Posted: Feb 15th 2012 10:20PM Rialle said

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@oxlar

I agree that they need to consider releasing servers without this rule set. Unless they are willing to have a small player base. I'm all for getting some complexity back into MMOs, and Pathfinder Online sounds like it could potentially be interesting, but with a full looting FFA PvP system you are basically telling players, "NO CASUALS ALLOWED."
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Posted: Feb 16th 2012 12:42AM SgtBaker1234556 said

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@oxlar

I think you're simply missing the fact that this is not meant to be single-player/solo game. Approaching a game like this requires completely different mindset - you can't play SWTOR, WoW, WAR, AoC or any of the current solo theme-parks and base your requirements on those templates.

The open PvP/loot issue isn't really a big deal unless you try to solo it. Just look at EVE - it implements roughly the same mechanic, and it's really not bad at all - you just have to find right corp and alliance - and your freighter jumps into 0.0 become much easier.

Playing together is the key. You don't "solo quest" in games like these.
That would be "doing it wrong".
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