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Reader Comments (11)

Posted: Jan 19th 2012 2:20PM (Unverified) said

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A lot of good points here, but there are a few things I wanna comment on.

1. Applications. I agree that 99% of the time, apps are worthless. Most of the time they are just looking for availability, experience, and gear.

The 1% of the apps that I feel work are the ones looking for specific information for a long term guild. They ask personality questions because Jim from Rift doesn't play Allods Online, but seeing that recruit John plays makes him hop on mumble and chat with him a bit about a neat tidbit in his application. Or maybe the guild has special rules, and failing to understand these rules can cause serious issues (i.e. if members are to be trusted with bank access, but you take things out of the bank to sell on the AH, you're probably breaking a rule ;P ).

2. Guild nanny. I think the guild leader should be able to listen to people, but yes, it isn't their job to fix things. The guild leader needs to encourage people to work civily to fix their own problems because, tbh, a lot of adults just don't know how to do this. A good guild leader is someone mature enough to understand this issue and be willing to mediate if things get bad to avoid huge fallouts. I've seen guild leaders try to dodge this bullet and say, "Fix it or I boot all of you" and it never ends well. Give folks the tools to fix it themselves and act as a last resort.

3. Helping those who fall behind in general. I think this one in particular applies to themepark MMOs, but I have to agree. Simply put, some people would rather play alts all day, and the only way for them to get up is if someone holds their hand the whole way to the top. Unless they're a very good friend or somehow disabled/special needs, you probably should have this person do it on their own so they learn the value of the work involved. Otherwise, entitlement settles in followed by its good friend "Drama."

Posted: Jan 19th 2012 2:30PM Daverator said

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I must be behind the times because I've never heard the term "Backflagging"

Posted: Jan 19th 2012 2:32PM fallwind said

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reminds me of my ex guild leader in Rift. She had one of the better known Defiant, heavy-rp guilds on Faeblight.... and she was burning up faster than a big mac coming out of low-earth orbit.

She had created a point system where members got awarded points for doing guild events / guild RP / forum RP that could be spent to improve the "rp d20 system" she made up to handle things like combat etc when the ingame system was not idea (like a level 15 bodyguard vs a lvl 50 attacker).

Well, every week she would tally everyone's points, send out a forum email to them to let them know how many they had, updated their forum avatar to include how many unspent points they had, and re-update the avatar again when they spent the points. It was a horrible cluster ____ of a system.

I offered to help fix it, game system design is what I do for a living, she refused. She didnt want someone else to touch "her guild".

Two weeks later, she announced that she was leaving the game and deleting the guild (even though we had a dozen players who could have taken over)

Posted: Jan 19th 2012 3:33PM mysecretid said

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My guilds are always comprised of real-life friends, and friend-of-a-friends, which makes things so much easier.

Everybody knows up-front that foafs are on unofficial probation. This means they're in unless I hear complaints about them. I hear significant complaints about any foafs (even my own), they're out. No trial, it's just done.

And their sponsor knows (without even being told) that any new blood they bring in will be looked at even more carefully next time.

My only job, whenever I've been guild leader, has been to solicit possible group-play opportunity windows via e-mail, and to announce same when they arise.

If no one's preferring a teaming time, I just send out a reminder before weekends of what days/times should be optimal.

This system won't work for everyone, I know, but it has served us well these many years. I share it here as an example of a low-stress guild for those who may be wondering.

Posted: Jan 19th 2012 3:54PM (Unverified) said

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@mysecretid

No offense, but the "RL friends and friends of friends" system is something I've learned to actively avoid. I find more drama in those guilds than any other kind of guild. For example, my brother and his friends tried to do this for a raiding guild. Despite them all knowing each other IRL, and there only being 8 of them (they'd get 2 pugs), they formed about 6 cliques and raiding lasted about a month. None of them were new to the game or MMOs either.

Another guy I know was in a similar situation. Only 4 of them, wanting to do a hardcore raiding guild in a similar fashion. Of the 4, only 3 got the game, and only 2 preordered. Of the 2, only 1 really tried recruiting for the guild, and she wasn't very successful since she tried recruiting from other established guilds (who had more people, were more organized, and *gasp* cared more about the people in the guild than giving out rights just because you can punch the guild leader IRL).

I wouldn't let my fragile little sister on a football team with me just because she's my sister, so why do the same with a guild if she's not really going to group up or help out with it? Sorry, RL guilds have just as many problems as people who get to know each other in game, if not more in my experience. I'd rather be in a guild that's fair to the members based on what they do for the guild than in one based on RL relationships that may not extend into the game.
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Posted: Jan 19th 2012 4:51PM jimr9999us said

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woot! more kitties. Massively needs an "all cats day" That's a very funny bit as well btw :)

As for guild leadership...I'm just glad as heck gamers out there love doing it! A hard seemingly thankless task but essential...

A GL holiday!

Posted: Jan 19th 2012 7:07PM Vandal said

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@jimr9999us I laughed at that pic too. That was a hilarious commercial, now I need to Youtube it lol

I think much of the blame for why running guilds is so hard should be squarely placed on the MMO developers who implement flawed game mechanics.

For example the article mentions "(DKP) can blossom into a second job if not done right." Exactly right, but why was DKP implemented in the first place? Because devs wanted to stifle player progression to keep those subs stretching out so they created mechanics that force players to fight over resources/XP/loot. Mechanics so bad that players needed to create their own meta-system to deal with it.

I think just s MMOs are evolving to be *games* rather than second jobs
that running guilds will end up being a bit easier.
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Posted: Jan 20th 2012 12:28PM StClair said

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@jimr9999us
I've had that commercial on my HD for years. Grabbed it off Youtube. Still love it.
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Posted: Jan 19th 2012 9:54PM mysecretid said

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@(Unverified)

And I repeat --

"This system won't work for everyone, I know, but it has served us well these many years"

Posted: Jan 20th 2012 10:15AM (Unverified) said

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The header picture pretty much sums up what it's like to lead a guild.

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