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Reader Comments (106)

Posted: Dec 29th 2011 5:14PM Chiren said

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@Ceridith

Totally agree. I played WoW during TBC era, and LFG (aka trade) was always lively, and it was always nice to see people rising to the challenge. Hopefully I'm not too biased about it, but I was a tank, so maybe I don't appreciate the LFTank frustration that many groups have.

You met people, and socialized, and made friends as well as a few preferentially distant acquaintances.

Years later I tried out Cataclysm and used LFG for a run. No one talked. Everyone just ran around, silently jumping around. It wasn't until we were well into the instance that I realized some of the people I were running with weren't even on the same server, which really killed a lot of the desire to communicate I think.

If people must have a LFG tool fine - but cross-server is pretty damaging to the social aspect of the game.
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Posted: Dec 29th 2011 4:16PM (Unverified) said

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I came back to wow after a lengthy recess for one reason: the dungeon finder.

I left due to being bored. Probably from: the dungeon finder.

Still - I can't live without it. Right now what I wanted to be a healer is a caster dps because I can't stand the "lfg tool" in swtor. I put it in quotes because it's a checkbox and a comment box.

Posted: Dec 29th 2011 4:17PM (Unverified) said

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No


LFG is a bad a tool as a whole, when a game has server only grouping, you have to behave, you make friends, and follow the unwritten rules of conduct (loot, breaks, watching your mouth). LFG killed wow for a lot of long time players, it kills the climate, makes everyone sort of have a attitude.

Posted: Dec 29th 2011 4:17PM santiagodraco said

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SWTOR needs a lot, including a good LFG tool. The game is severely lacking in standard MMO features around grouping, combat, UI etc.

Grouping is fine in MMOs... provided you do it right, like Rift or WoW. Force players to have to work at grouping....like Bioware has done (not only work but the implementation itself is broken) and you'll end up without groups....

On top of that the game requires grouping for many things....

It boggles the mind how a company as solid as Bioware can so miss the mark and spend a ton of money doing it.

Posted: Dec 29th 2011 4:48PM (Unverified) said

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@santiagodraco

Yep, sure is hard to look for a group in SWTOR.

/1 Hey, is anyone doing the heroics?

Yeah, man, that was SO hard. Being social in a social game in a massively multiplayer world OH MAN I WISH THEY'D MAKE IT EASIER.
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Posted: Dec 29th 2011 10:36PM freebase said

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@santiagodraco

"Grouping is fine in MMOs... provided you do it right, like Rift or WoW."

^^This is the most ignorant statement I've read all day by someone who wasn't trolling.
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Posted: Jan 7th 2012 12:28AM Daeths said

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@freebase I dont know about WoW, but Rift had a good system that actually allowed people to get stuff done. Trust me, chat spamming in rift gets you no where
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Posted: Dec 29th 2011 4:21PM KvanCetre said

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Repeating "LF Healer" in general chat does get annoying...

Posted: Dec 29th 2011 4:22PM smartstep said

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I think problems that LFG queue tools brings outweight advantage they deliver. So no thanks but no thanks.

Posted: Dec 29th 2011 4:23PM (Unverified) said

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An LFG tool is unneeded. A server-only LFG tool would be barely tolerable, but cross server and you're looking at WoW all over again.

Posted: Dec 29th 2011 4:35PM KvanCetre said

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@(Unverified)
You're really desperate to get SWoWTOR to stick, aren't ya? They're different games in similiar genre. Battlefield 3 and Modern Warfare 3 are both modern military shooters, but anyone who has played both will tell you they are very different games with obvious similarities.
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Posted: Dec 29th 2011 4:39PM Spacegrass said

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@KvanCetre

Please don't feed the trolls.
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Posted: Dec 29th 2011 4:48PM KvanCetre said

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@Spacegrass
But what to do with the bulk bag of Troll-feed I got from Costco? :/
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Posted: Dec 29th 2011 5:20PM Kalex716 said

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@(Unverified)

I did a detailed analysis of a slice from each main feature in SWOTR and compared to WoW with a checklist and the only thing SWOTR has really as far as main features go that WoW does not is the space ship content. Everything else is a play from their playbook (some almost exactly, some deviating a bit more).

When you make a game that correlates so similarly, you will undoubtedly run into issue's that they are already where the user base wants everything the older brother product has. And this is normal because if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and has feathers like a duck, it may as well be a duck. This is the bed Bioware made, I sure hope they can handle it.
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Posted: Dec 29th 2011 5:40PM (Unverified) said

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@Kalex716

I guess your WoW v TOR checklist didn't include these things (ya know, since the game are so similar, amirite?):

Voiceover
Cutscenes
Story
Class Quests
No Level Bracket Warzones
Actual Talent Trees
Advanced Classes
Companions
Weather Effects
Moddable Gear
Crafting With Companions
Difficult Heroic Quests (where you can die!)
Datacrons
Titles at Low Levels
Spaceships/Player Housing
Bind Points/Quick Travel (to multiple spots)
AOE Looting
Fighting More Than One Mob at a Time
Legacy Surnames/Titles
Story Chapters (provides a sense of completion)
Commendation Gear & Mods for Each Planet
No Sparkle Ponies (yet)

Yep, they're exact clones, I TELL YA!
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Posted: Dec 29th 2011 6:09PM Spacegrass said

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@(Unverified)

Don't forget the Outlaw's Den, as far as I know Warcraft has nothing like that.
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Posted: Dec 30th 2011 2:33AM (Unverified) said

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@(Unverified)

Voiceover
Cutscenes
^WoW has both, granted in far less abundance.

Story
^Plenty of story in WoW if you bother to read it

Class Quests
^WoW has always had class quests up to and including the rogue-only legendary dagger quests in the latest patch. Not in the same abundance as TOR however.

No Level Bracket Warzones
^Which are a terrible idea according to everything I've read about them

Actual Talent Trees
^Directly ripped off from WoW circa 2005

Advanced Classes
^AKA permanent specs, a huge step backward

Companions
^Just makes every class a pet class AKA hunter/warlock

Weather Effects
^LOL c'mon. WoW has had weather for years.

Moddable Gear
^In WoW you can customize gear through gems, enchants, and reforging, not to mention change its appearance

Crafting With Companions
^I'll give you this one. One of TOR's only innovations.

Difficult Heroic Quests (where you can die!)
^I agree it's nice to have some challenge when you level.

Datacrons
^Not something that's in WoW but it's hardly an original idea.

Titles at Low Levels
^Giving them out at low levels doesn't make them a different concept.

Spaceships/Player Housing
^Each class has the same ship. I'd rather have no housing than lame, soulless housing.

Bind Points/Quick Travel (to multiple spots)
^A nice improvement over WoW's hearthstone, but the same fundamental concept

AOE Looting
^Another nice improvement, but why do we still have to click on corpses in these games at all?

Fighting More Than One Mob at a Time
^Pretty sure you do this in WoW sometimes, too :P

Legacy Surnames/Titles
^Something WoW should emulate when they add cross-character achievements in the next expansion.

Story Chapters (provides a sense of completion)
^AKA zones

Commendation Gear & Mods for Each Planet
^AKA badges/points/chef's awards/marks of the world tree/darkmoon prize tickets

No Sparkle Ponies (yet)
^Give it time

You can deny it all you want, but TOR's gameplay, combat, actual questing, and class design is fundamentally the same as WoW. It's blatantly obvious to anyone who has played both games.
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Posted: Dec 29th 2011 4:32PM KvanCetre said

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@(Unverified)
Oh Bob, you bring so much to the Massively community.
Every post is like a ray of sunshine.
Angry, rage-fueled sunshine..

Posted: Dec 29th 2011 4:38PM Spacegrass said

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As long as it isn't cross-server, a looking for group tool is a necessary evil. Spending time in general chat trying to get a group together may work for people who don't contribute to society and have 16 hours a day to play a game, but players who have real-world responsibilities need something faster. When you only have an hour of free time, spending half of that forming a group doesn't leave you with a lot. I haven't had a problem finding groups in SWTOR, but it's still a new game, with a lot of players in the low-mid level areas. In the long run, it's going to need a group finder.

Posted: Dec 29th 2011 4:43PM KvanCetre said

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@Spacegrass
The random nature of the dungeon finder can help too, by "Forcing" players to do all content and not only do heroics that have the gear they want.

Then again, anyone who played WOTLK knows the reaction to getting placed in H-Occulus...
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