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Reader Comments (20)

Posted: Nov 10th 2011 3:34PM (Unverified) said

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@pvpirl

Yeah! Me either! Screw that imaginary guild! I'm going to join some other imaginary guild that is okay with me not constantly being online.

Rabble rabble rabble rabble rabble rabble rabble!

Posted: Nov 10th 2011 3:34PM SwarlesBarkley said

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I like guilds (err kinships in Lotro), but I like flexibility too. I started school earlier this year and let my kinship know that my entire schedule would be changing because of this. I only had nine months to finish school and it was time to do something positive for my family. I did try to attend raids and only signed up to the ones I knew for sure I could attend. The only problem was that after only attending one raid that first six weeks suddenly I was not allowed to raid because my stats were suddenly not up to par, even though I had continued to play regularly just at different times of the day (ie; non-peak times so the kin leaders did not see me as much).

I wound up quitting the kinship in question because the direction the were heading in tended to be more stricter on the raiding side than they had ever been and I did not want to be an obtrusion. 6 months later and I just spoke with one of my ex-kin members and things have certainly changed. Now they only take dedicated members and have run off anyone who might have been a little casual (only signing up for 2-4 raids per month instead of twice a week every week. I am glad I left, but its a shame that some guilds/kins have to start to take raiding so seriously. My casual playstyle does not seem to mesh well with many kins, even those who claim to be also be casual raiders. They somehow always seem to have hardcore tendencies.

Posted: Nov 10th 2011 3:42PM (Unverified) said

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@SwarlesBarkley

I've had a similar, though different thing happen to myself.

I'm an officer in a guild, but I switched from 2nd to first shift. This also included working 10 hours 4 days a week, to 'working' 8 hours 5 days a weeks.

Ended up my raid times, no longer could match up with what the guild did. So I ended up completely stopping raiding. I still am somewhat active in the guild, but not nearly what I was once before.

What upsets me is I would like to raid yet, but I don't want to leave the guild I'm in to do so. I have a strong connection with a few of the guildies that I don't want to lose as friends. While that's not always lost when you leave a guild, from past experience I haven't been lucky enough for it to not effect those friendships that were built.
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Posted: Nov 10th 2011 6:13PM DarkWalker said

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@(Unverified)
This is why I really like the idea of allowing players to be part of multiple guilds at the same time. Seems like FFXI does it, GW2 already announced it will also feature this, etc.
In fact, GW2 will be the first game where I might look for a more content-oriented guild; in games that only allow a character to be part of a single guild, I will always pick a casual and friendly guild.
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Posted: Nov 10th 2011 3:43PM jimr9999us said

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I don't see how you could enjoy a mmog w/o a guild, and was shocked to see only a little more than half of the respondents were in one...

Mmog's aren't very good single player games...the idea of playing one w/o raiding or even guild dungeons is puzzling to me, especially since there are guilds out there for every kind of player.

-shrug-

Posted: Nov 10th 2011 4:11PM SwarlesBarkley said

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@jimr9999us
I like being in guilds myself, but to say that its almost necessary is not true. You can play many MMO's without ever talking to another person let alone being in a guild. There are people who treat MMO's like a single player game and do not worry about raiding or having top elite gear. To each their own.
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Posted: Nov 10th 2011 5:56PM Geminosity said

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@jimr9999us to be honest, it's not quite as binary as that :3

Rather than solo vs guild it's quite possible to approach the game socially without guilds at all. Using myself as an example, I'm actually a very social player, however I do not like limiting my associations to a guild. I've always loved the 'Massive' part of Massively Multiplayer games and tying myself down to just a few people always seemed like an odd expectation to me.

I appreciate for some the sense of identity or common goal a guild might lend might make it easier to meet new people within the confines of their guild or give them a solid base of people they can rely on but it's never been something I've needed and constantly meeting new people is one of the great joys of these games for me :3

I don't join MMOs to just experience new worlds, but also to hopefully meet equally as strange and unknown people in these unfamiliar backdrops as well. It really helps round out the sense of adventure when I walk into these worlds initially not knowing a soul and unless I actively keep a low profile know I'll hit the friend cap in the first day or two so there's no need to rely on existing connections :D

I know that's not everyone's thing, but I bring it up to illustrate that not everyone outside of a guild is necessarily alone :3
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Posted: Nov 10th 2011 6:26PM DarkWalker said

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@jimr9999us
Depends. Most modern MMOs (or, at least, those that allow players to level to max level while playing solo) make for fairly good, if long, single player experiences.

So, for players that don't mind not doing the group content, or only doing it through PUGs, not being in a guild is perfectly acceptable.

A few are even more solo friendly. GW2 will actually allow players to do almost all content (except for the instances that take small groups) without needing to formally group even once. This even Includes the raid-like events, complete with getting the rewards from them even when playing without a formal group.
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Posted: Nov 10th 2011 6:54PM trinta said

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@jimr9999us - If you're puzzled at the idea of playing an MMO without guild dungeons and raiding, how do you even know that there are different types of players for guilds to accommodate? You only seem to be aware of one type of player: yourself.

It's entirely possible to PvP, run duo or trio content, quest, build reputation, craft, gather, play the AH, and a number of other things--all without a guild. I can't imagine regularly raiding without a guild, but that doesn't mean that I can't enjoy an MMO without belonging to a guild.

"I don't enjoy playing the game that way" does not mean "The game cannot be enjoyed without playing it my way."
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Posted: Nov 11th 2011 10:54AM SnarlingWolf said

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@jimr9999us

I found I started to enjoy MMOs far more once I stop joining guilds.

Guilds tend to take themselves way too seriously. It is a game, I am playing for fun. I don't want to stop what I'm doing in game to have a guild face to face meeting in a town. Even worse when it is for no reason and the guild leader has nothing to talk about because he didn't think it through.

I don't want to be told I have to hurry up and level because the guild needs more people at high level to do Raids. Not only that, I friggin hate raiding with a passion and don't want to do it at all in any game.

I don't want to pay some of my in-game money to the guild, or be forced to donate loot that I could sell on the auction house for a decent amount of cash to the guild.

I don't want to deal with the drama of guilds. The bitterness of people to one another. Officers who have gotten power hungry. Military like leadership (I already did my time in the real military, I'm all set with that).

I don't want to be forced to be in your vent channel (this one has been almost universal in guilds). I don't like to use vent. I also don't like having to hear about your cat, your kid, or you chomping down on food for ever. I want to stick to typing, thanks.

I want to log in. Have some fun. Do what I want to do. And logout when I want to. Without a guild it works so much better. In most games I don't have a problem finding a public group that I can go run through a group dungeon if I need to.

I actually like helping other players out so in some games once I level my guy up, I'll go back to the early zones and offer to help people through the quests that were tough. So it isn't an anti-social issue or anything like that. It is simply that guilds are usually ridiculous.
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Posted: Nov 10th 2011 3:47PM nimzy said

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I've seen guild applications worse than job applications. I've seen trials worse than actual real-world auditions.

If it's not fun to be in a guild, you won't find me there.

Posted: Nov 16th 2011 12:09AM (Unverified) said

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@nimzy Fair enough. Just be aware that a lot of guild leaders have also had to deal with people who want to join a guild for all the wrong reasons.

Most people see applications as some sort of exclusionary tool designed to keep people out. I see applications as an inclusionary tool to make sure that only the right type of applicant even makes it to our roster in the first place.
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Posted: Nov 10th 2011 3:54PM Borick said

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There's too much scheduled, sports-like team play going on in the viable guilds, and too much donut-humping in the casual guilds.

If I was seeking challenge, then a guild would be good, but since I'm seeking casual-yet-constructive play, I'm better off in Minecraft.

There's very little out there for people who aren't interested in competitive play, and don't want to be on a structured sports-like team.

Posted: Nov 10th 2011 4:39PM (Unverified) said

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Maybe it's because all the everquest characters look so much alike, but I swear that's a screenshot of my guild. Crazy

Posted: Nov 10th 2011 4:41PM EuchridEucrow said

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In World of Warcraft, I was one of the founding members of a guild that ended up becoming the top guild on the server(for raid progression), horde-side. It was cool as hell and aggravating as fuck. While I am done with the need to do that again, I would advise someone that hasn't tried playing a game at that level to go ahead and give it a shot. It is quite an experience, both negative and positive, that shouldn't be passed up if you see the opportunity.

Posted: Nov 10th 2011 6:30PM smartstep said

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Mmorpg's are diffrent. Nowadays they are focused on doing instances over and over and not much else due to LFG tools and auto-teleporting + things like dps meters and gear score in WoW, makes many guilds
"you don't have good gear enough go away" or "ok nice you joined now you have to get decent stuff FAST!" or "we require you to do dungeon running/ raiding 3 / times week mimimum".

Add that casually meeting people and making people know in open world is much rarer and harder due to very fast levelling + everyone just run solo + most people race to end level = guild are searched through websites, forums and sometimes through in-game chat advertisements.

So guilds became less for people grouping for fun and cooperation and more like joining organizatiuon and / or having to meet requirements for work.

That's why many people avoid guilds atm.


Modern mmorpg's concepts and overall construct created this change.

Posted: Nov 10th 2011 6:38PM Space Cobra said

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I know I answered before with a variety of concerns, but I didn't see my main concern addressed, which I may've not made clear. I know my main concern is really on my shoulders, so there is little a guild can do about it.

SwarlesBarkley covered most of it, even tangentially. It's basically, "I don't want to be a problem to others in the guild". I like some flexibility and jumping around to different games, online and offline. Sometimes, I don't log in enough and I can totally understand getting kicked, especially if I don't give prior notice (or if I do, my time away starts getting longer). There's a variety of factors for it. Me being a loner. Me being friendly enough with the guild and they me, but not "clicking" with them. Not website to leave a message. Goals of a guild changing. I could go on.

But, it's mostly on "me"; I realize that. I'd like to join a group; maybe a guild who plays in many games probably would be best, but I have yet to locate a good one that has staying power in my search.

Posted: Nov 10th 2011 6:40PM DarkWalker said

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I would be more willing to get into guilds to do group content if the group content was more flexible.

I'm not playing a game to sit in a bench or to be left out of some group activity just because there are more players than spots (or, even worse, because there are already too many players with the same class/role/whatever as me).

I don't want to be prevented from playing what is supposedly the pinnacle of content in a game just because the game does not allow me to play it more than once a week and my guild is going to attempt it later that week.

I play a game to have fun. Not to risk being unable to actually play, to be bound by guild-dictated schedules, etc.

Unfortunately, I can't bring myself to play the one MMO that seems to go around this restriction: CoH. While I otherwise like the game, due to the way it handles specs and restricts respecs I always end leaving it in a week or two.

On the other hand, GW2 seems like it will fit the bill nicely, with a spec system I believe I will love, and extreme flexibility in most group content.

Posted: Nov 11th 2011 1:48AM Barrikade said

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I would say that being in a guild definitely helped me to enjoy WoW more than I could have otherwise. I was in a smaller guild, a group of tightly knit players who generally liked playing together.

However, being in the guild also kept me playing WoW long after I grew bored of it. Like I said, I liked the people in the guild - for the most part - so even though I was getting bored with the game I would still log on to raid, because I felt like I owed it to them.

I did finally quit halfway through Wrath, and came back to give Cata a try (and have since quit again), but I'm not interested in scheduling my life around raids anymore, so I don't think I'll be doing the guild thing in the next games I play.

Posted: Nov 11th 2011 3:15PM JuliusSeizure said

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So, uh, since last week I did in fact join a Supergroup, but it's purely an RP thing and extremely casual. In fact, they had absolutely no requirement for me to actually join them to claim in character membership. Naturally, that felt very gratifying so I did join them to get proper base access and earn them Prestige to make the base even better.

Such a great community. :)

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