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Reader Comments (17)

Posted: Sep 25th 2011 12:11PM Seffrid said

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Perfectly put Jef, you covered all the bases very well.

In a nutshell, there has to be a reason to craft, and that reason has to be a combination of the fun you get from doing it and the knowledge that other players will want the end product. Neither of those conditions is met at present, for the reasons you've explained so well.

Posted: Sep 25th 2011 12:44PM Tatsuk said

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It's all the more puzzling when you look at the crafting system Funcom devised nearly a decade earlier for Anarchy Online.

Posted: Sep 25th 2011 1:18PM BigAndShiny said

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Maybe next week you could talk about what you want from the next adventure pack/expansion, and where you see the game going longterm.

Posted: Sep 27th 2011 2:50PM Jef Reahard said

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@BigAndShiny

Will definitely do that soon, not sure about next week though.
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Posted: Sep 25th 2011 1:24PM Dumac said

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Hey i thought that mobs spawning when you gather is an interesting twist on random things that happen while gathering, but i understand that fighting them is a chore. They shouldn't be removed, maybe they should be made non-aggressive instead and just pout and curse the gods that they arrived too late to harvest.

I thought actually learning to harvest is too much of a chore for me. LOTS of traveling, too few nodes (or too many players, either way) and then the NPC takes your mats from you. I didn't bother. So i cant really say what i think of the actual crafting.

Posted: Sep 25th 2011 1:57PM Ref Minor said

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Nice post, for me crafting and a player run economy is the crucial difference (along with death penalties to keep the economy primed) between a theme park and a sandbox

Posted: Sep 25th 2011 2:21PM Faction 3 said

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As usual Jef, you posted a great article, loved reading it.

Even though Im not 40 yet (too many alts...I finally settled on a Bear Shaman), the Crafting mechanincs of AoC have me not even thinking of Crafting, whatsoever. Even though Im not a big crafter in general, the perks of having say, a Chef, or a Blacksmith alt is a monumental advantage to your stable of characters if you put the time in to level it up, so I'd probably go for it based on that point alone...

But in AoC the crafting is so backwards and flawed, that I can't believe someone thought this was a good idea, ever. I am, however, excited for the "Massive Overhaul" that they're doing. I look foward to that BIGTIME, especially since I'll (hopefully...) be 80 with at least one character by that time.

Other news: Dark Templars are an awesome class...thats what held up my decision on Class choice between a Bear Shaman or DT. Goddamn uniqeness!! I'll probably make my free-50 a DT.

Anyway, good write-up Jef. Nice work.

Posted: Sep 25th 2011 2:22PM Faction 3 said

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uniqueness*
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Posted: Sep 25th 2011 7:33PM (Unverified) said

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I love Jef and I think he has some great articles. But this is def not one of them,

We can blatently see that you ALREADY dont like AOC that much AND think the level 40 crafting start is a problem (which it isnt).

If people only want to craft and thats it, there are PLENTY of games for that.

For AOC being a huegly combat-oriented game, along with amazing pvp and spectaculat pve, people should be GRATEFUL crafting was even included and at the massive scale it is currently.

Add more to the system - yes
Take away anything in the system - no

Posted: Sep 25th 2011 10:02PM OutThere said

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@(Unverified)

Mmmm. Hate on crafting much?
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Posted: Sep 25th 2011 10:18PM OutThere said

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While I really liked the combat in AoC, the crafting just turned me off. Having to go to a separate zone to start crafting, getting there, then being jumped 9 times out of 10 while gathering was annoying. You are 100% right about the bag space for all the components, which you get to carry around with you for endless levels until you can actually craft something. I just sold everything I gathered to buy a horse. Best decision I ever made.

I was also unthrilled by the gating of crafting behind a lot of other game content. I really wish developers would get over this "You want to be a great crafter? Ya, well, you have to raid first" mentality. Well, devs, if you want me to raid to craft you first need to provide me with some awesome recipes worth spending my precious time raiding for and right now there isn't a single MMO that makes crafted gear the equal of raid gear. And if I'm going to raid for mats, well, I might as well raid for gear which makes the mats moot. See how awesomely asinine raiding for crafting mats is?

At the highest levels, crafting should have its own quest line to gain access to rare mats. Being a master craftsman should mean something more than just a title. The next MMO that comes out that actually offers a viable crafting system independent of raiding will have my hard-earned bucks. It seems very unlikely this will be Conan, however, considering the deep hole they are starting in.

Posted: Sep 25th 2011 11:14PM Graill440 said

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This was a good chuckle from way back..."Finally, egads, the frickin' bank and inventory slots (and no, a $15 item shop bag is not an acceptable solution)."

Whne i had a sub the inventory and banking system sucked, interesting to see nothing changed in all this time. Also interesting to see the crafting system is still screwed over, and the big laugh...now they are going to address it, after the game is a ghost?

Aoc has settled alongside the other niche games, EVE, Rift, AC, Everquest, FF, etc, etc. Only the hardcore fanfolks and those with time invested that will not leave power these titles keeping them on life support.

These AOC devs, they are so funny. (Grin)

Posted: Sep 26th 2011 8:56AM (Unverified) said

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i didnt bother reading it all like usually :P i figured it was like anarchy online crafting theres only 1 piece of gear to craft*carb armor* thats sells.

sure is some high lvl stuff,but 99% of the time its a money sink.

was nice you didnt have to camp alot of mobs though

Posted: Sep 26th 2011 11:47AM Poordevil said

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AoC is only my second MMO and I never tried crafting in the 9 months I played WoW, so I don't know much about crafting in general.

All I know is what I have experienced in AoC is not all that fun. I would love to see a system introduced that would bring crafting up to the same standard of quality as the music, graphics, and combat. In other words a strong point of the game rather than a weakly implemented concession to the concept.
And all the gathering areas that seem so ignored! Large beautiful zones that get very little player use. Something needs to be done that brings Poitan, Purple Lotus Swamp, and Lachesh Plains back into the mainstream of the game instead of feeling like isolated, backwater locations.
Never having done much crafting I don't have specifics to offer that would explain how crafting could be improved, I only see that the current system has room for improvement. The biggest hurdle for me is that it is just not much fun to do. I have more fun grinding mobs, and selling all my resources at the Trader.

Posted: Sep 26th 2011 12:44PM nimzy said

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"When coupled with the prevalent (and misguided) view of crafters as dastardly capitalists to be avoided at all costs, it presents a challenging design conundrum."

If you've seen the economies of some games, you'd understand why people get this perception.

Posted: Sep 27th 2011 2:49PM Jef Reahard said

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@nimzy

I understand perfectly, I just don't agree with the view at all (and there are few MMORPG economies I haven't seen first-hand fwiw).
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Posted: Sep 27th 2011 3:15PM BigAndShiny said

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awesome
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