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Reader Comments (73)

Posted: Sep 11th 2011 9:54AM PacketBurner said

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In answer to the question star legends (a guilty secret tucked away on my advent Vega) although I'd also like to see them improve the game. The biggest problem I see from the 'pushers' like these games is their entire game pushes you to the cash shop and over rewards for said purchases with game breaking features or buffs.

I personally dislike the mindset of AAA games like TSW double dipping but conceed this does look like a 'full' AAA game. Strapping a sub on star legends wouldn't work without a change in game mindset.

Posted: Sep 11th 2011 10:05AM Valentina said

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Allods, definitely. Very unique game visually and lore-wise, I think they could benefit from adding a subscription option, that gives perks thus making it freemium. I think they'd do much better that way!

Posted: Sep 11th 2011 10:26AM Sunlover said

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I am going to go a different route with this and ask the question: "What F2P games/MMOs should offer a price model similar to GW/GW2?" I'm also not sure why more MMORPG gamers AREN'T asking this question. How is it that Arenanet can offer so much content and quality and keep servers up for all their customers and not need to bother you with a subscription?

I love my video game deals. I spent last night taking advantage of some awesome deals on Amazon. Example: I got RIFT for 13 dollars. Yes, 13 dollars, instant download. Pretty sweet. Now, will I play the heck out of it for the next 30 days? Absolutely. After that though? Probably not. I beta tested RIFT, so I know I'll like the game, but I won't like it enough to pay 15 dollars a month continuously. I just can't do it. If I was, I'd just resub to WoW anyway, which I have no desire to do. I like both WoW AND Rift, but neither one enough to justify spending 15 dollars a month (And definitely NOT 30 dollars to play both). As I said, I love my game deals, and as a bargain gamer, especially one who works and is busy with friends, family, and other interests, paying $15 per month when I know that most of my play time for that month will be eaten up by other commitments/interests/responsibilities just does not seem like a good deal to me.

But Guild Wars I can always go back to. Guild Wars doesn't care if I bought anything at the store recently and doesn't even ask me to "subscribe". "What is this 'subscripshun' you speak of?" says Guild Wars. And for this, I love it and continue to log in and allow it permanent residency on my hard drive.

So I ask, instead of subs, why not let players purchase content in large "chunks" as GW does? Why not let me buy Everquest 2's 1-60 content, with a decent amount of character slots, classes, bag space, storage, crafting, master skill usage, and auction house/broker usage, among other things, for a nice flat fee? 20 to 30 dollars perhaps? Why not do the same for Age of Conan? Lord of the Rings Online? Lego Universe? Rift? Etc. Other expansion packs could unlock more content, like levels 61-80, new dungeons, zones, abilities, flying mounts, classes, races, and more. Why not allow for a more complete gameplay experience with less restrictions, allowing players to feel less like second-rate visitors and more like permanent residents in these virtual worlds? I know I'd spend lots more money and time on these games than I do now if these services were bundled together and offered at more reasonable one-time-payment prices. I'm sure other gamers would too, and they could still offer plenty of other goodies in their in game shops.

So, while F2P/Freemium game pricing models seem to be all the rage these days, I'm betting that it will be GW/GW 2/Arenanet's model that will truly change the way things work. I mean, I don't understand how anyone will be able to justify monthly subs for their games when GW2 will offer just about everything they do without the monthly fee and restrictions? Even if you aren't a fan of GW2 (and Arenanet or NCsoft) for whatever reason, gameplay, art style (as strange as I'd find that...), less emphasis on raiding, more emphasis on PvP, or whatever, you still have to admit that the way A-Net sells their game could shake things up for good. Especially if they deliver on all of the promises they've made. With their track record and pedigree (Ex-Blizzard), I don't see why they won't.

I don't see why anyone else can't either.

P.S. -If you made it this far, you deserve a hug. Sorry for the wall of text on a Sunday morning! =D

Posted: Sep 11th 2011 10:49AM osamaelshimy said

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@Sunlover Give me my hug.
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Posted: Sep 11th 2011 11:03AM Gamewench said

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@Sunlover weeee a hug from jooo

I agree with what you're saying though =)
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Posted: Sep 11th 2011 12:09PM Sunlover said

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@osamaelshimy

>:D
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Posted: Sep 11th 2011 12:10PM Sunlover said

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@Gamewench

((Gamewench))
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Posted: Sep 11th 2011 12:54PM Bladerunner83 said

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@Sunlover

"So I ask, instead of subs, why not let players purchase content in large "chunks" as GW does?"

Isn't that considered a freemium model? Free up to a point, but you have to pay to advance past a specific level; Even then you have to pay for an initial price and any expansion they release. Guild Wars started with an awesome model, but the major difference between sub and GW is that a sub game releases new content on a regular basis, while GW released a retail version and new content was a $20 expansion. Arenanet needs to make money too, they just do it like a traditional single player game. It's the only model that people like, because you dont have to pay on a regular basis. Imagine the gain in revenue if only they switch to a sub model. Arenanet has not produced another IP other than Guild Wars since the release of GW in 2005. It's funny reading some of the other topic about GW2, were people bash Blizzard for being greedy, but they don't realize that Arenanet was founded by former Blizzard employees, originally called Triforge, Inc.
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Posted: Sep 11th 2011 9:29PM alinos said

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@Bladerunner83

A) who they were founded by is irrelevant, You may as well go and say that runic are evil greedy bastards because they have people who founded blizzard north(maybe the reason all these people left is because they didn't like where blizzard was headed at the time)

B) Yeah B2P still means you need to buy an expansion to progress in content, but well it seems that most sub based MMO's do the same thing.

The most they ever add between expansion's are a couple of Raid's Which for all intensive purposes are generally the "Content" That should have been in the Expansion anyway.

Quick come buy our lich king expansion, oh right the lich isn't going to show up for 16 months. And using WoW as an example, my guess would be that of All it's sub fee's and expansion pack money, less than 25% of that is funneled back into the game.

It's not 1999 anymore server's don't have the expenses that they once had.
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Posted: Sep 11th 2011 11:03AM Utakata said

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Mabinogi...

...and with a 60 day gamecard sold in every game shop in North America.

Posted: Sep 11th 2011 11:05AM aaradun said

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@sunlover The only reason arenanet can offer free games like they do is that they don't really own a lot of servers like other games do. Most of the game runs off the people pc, and they don't have to pay for a lot of bandwith as that will be offloaded to other peoples. In most case it doesn't matter, but in reality that really hurts people with load bandwith as it will be consuming their monthly bandwith and they the one in a way that will end up paying for it.

I will reserve judgment but i doubt you'll have 100 of people in your general area other then in cities in GW2 since it's not out, unlike other mmo that have the infrastructure to do so.

So in short Arenanet can offer no membership since frankly they don't have any overhead.

Anyways time will tell, but companies are there to make money, and arenanet makes money but they make a small percentage than even the crapiest korean mmo makes and this not going to change.

Posted: Sep 11th 2011 11:06AM rockman0 said

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There's an item in the Allods cash shop, some kind of incense, I think, that negates the death penalty if you die. You have to carry them around with you and equip them. Those items are available for free. I bought like 500 of them and have never had to suffer the death penalty that other people dread so much.

Posted: Sep 11th 2011 11:28AM Pingles said

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@rockman0

Things must have changed.

Incense used to be to remove the damage-debuff and the free incense they gave away (one per day) only lasted 24 hours, requiring you to travel to the Capital City every day to get your free incense.
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Posted: Sep 11th 2011 11:07AM rockman0 said

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But to answer the question, I can't really say any. When I was plaing 9Dragons, I felt like that game should offer a sub. It had high quality subscrptions, unique game mechanics. I just didn't really feel like your usual Asian free to play MMO.

Posted: Sep 11th 2011 5:31PM rockman0 said

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Yeah, I could buy all of those items from the cash shop when I was playing. I bought them in bulk just in case it was a bug. :p
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Posted: Sep 11th 2011 11:36AM Pingles said

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Massively, I sure wish you would do a few editorials on the Free-to-Play mechanic.

There are a lot of misconceptions in the comments from seemingly quite a few people who I am assuming have never tried a Free-to-play. My assumption comes from the fact that the suspicions and accusations they have are completely bonkers.

As someone who plays free-to-play games (and used to be similarly misguided and vocal) I can state that most of the F2Ps I've played I have enjoyed without spending a dime. And the ones I DID give money to (to show my appreciation for their game) were just for bag space and cosmetic items.

Posted: Sep 11th 2011 1:37PM HiroProtagonist7 said

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@Pingles
You defend F2P to the death, so your answer was kind of the same as your other posts.

Considering your vocal position on F2P, I'd be especially interested in your answer the the question Eliot asked if you considered what parts of a game would make it worth a sub to you personally and what sort of changes in game play and content you'd demand knowing you couldn't skip difficult, boring or grindy stuff with buffs.

Pretend your uncle left you a crap ton of money, but specified that you could only use it to subscribe to one MMO at a time every six months. Not being able to buy anything from an item shop, what F2P game would you not be able to live without? Which would you like to convert to a sub model and what changes would need to be made to make it worth being your sole game for 6 months?
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Posted: Sep 11th 2011 2:24PM Pingles said

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@HiroProtagonist7

Ugh. My long winded reply seems to have not posted. I'll give it a minute or two to show up before rewriting it.
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Posted: Sep 11th 2011 2:41PM Pingles said

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@HiroProtagonist7
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Posted: Sep 11th 2011 2:59PM Pingles said

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@HiroProtagonist7

My answer is likely going to disappoint you.  And I purposely did not answer the original question for fear of sounding like a broken record.

A sub game requires a box price and then a monthly sub for me to play.  So the question really is what part of an F2P I am willing to get rid of to pay that price?

There isn't one.  I have paid into several F2P cash shops but it was just to support a game I was enjoying.  I bought bag space.  Am I willing to pay the sub fee every month for bag space?  No, I didn't need it, just bought it to spend my game bucks or whatever.  Same with costumes.  

I don't buy the XP boosts.  Heck, most games throw a few in for free every once in a while (Zentia and Runes of Magic have level-based gift boxes) and I don't even use those!  The grind most people say is a "problem" with F2Ps doesn't seem to be there for me.  And I quit WoW because of Rep grind... so I know my grind!  :) 

I will be buying The Old Republic but mainly for the license.  And if I saw a great review of an MMO I'd be willing to buy/sub so I am not anti-sub.  


TLDR reply: There are F2Ps out there that I enjoy as is.  I don't want to change anything.  So why saddle them with a sub?  To me that's a negative.
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