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Reader Comments (90)

Posted: Aug 23rd 2011 2:17PM real65rcncom said

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@AnotherPint
I agree with this very much.

My people wanting SWTOR to fail wants it to fail because their game could suffer from the subscriber exodus (Hi RIFT and Ren!) There is this general feeling among people playing a game now that in order for their game to succeed and survive, SWTOR must die. They fear the mass exodus of potential players and come up with 100 scenarios on why no one in their right mind would ever think about playing SWTOR. Then they log into their game and see nothing from dissent from their own communties that the game they are playing now is failing in many ways.

People have to learn that if you like your game, stick with it. Everyone else is going to try it and many probably won't (statiscally) stick around. They will leave for one reason or another.

But trying to scuttle a game before it's even launched is juvenile and only hurts the industry in the long run. There is room for everyone's tastes and just because your game has to close 40 servers or 200 doesn't mean you should root for the next game to end up that way.

Remember, as much as you hate WoW or SWTOR, without big budget games pulling in casuals, your game doesn't even get made in the first place.
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Posted: Aug 23rd 2011 1:47PM DarkWalker said

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I don't want TOR to fail, but I also don't want it to be a runaway success because it brings little to no innovation to the table. It's mostly WoW with lightsabers and voice overs. I feel like other MMOs are more deserving of succeeding than TOR.

Posted: Aug 23rd 2011 11:20PM TheClaw said

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@DarkWalker : Agreed 100%. If SW:TOR is a huge success, the industry will be stuck in 2005 for another five years, probably. Maybe longer. Imagine trying to get a publisher to support an innovative idea when the two smash hits of the last decade have been WoW and WoW with Lightsabers.
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Posted: Aug 23rd 2011 1:55PM jealouspirate said

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I'm torn, because to me SWTOR looks like a good game but not a good MMO. I want to play it, but I don't want other MMOs to follow in its footsteps. I basically view it as a single player Bioware game with battlegrounds.

The whole game is a large series of contradictions and conflicting design. It's like like wants so badly to be an awesome single-player Bioware RPG but has all these traditional MMOs trappings put in, and I don't think they mesh well together.

The stories, particularly the class stories, seem to ignore the fact that there are other players at all in the game. Every single Smuggler will have the exact same people as companions, and you'll see hundreds of copies of that same individual Wookie companion running around. It's bizarre.

Also the whole 'rolling a dice' in flashpoints to decide the outcome really turns me off, to the point I might just skip them. My Jedi loses a dice roll, so I have to commit the evil act and change the story? Ugh. The fact that you get Light or Dark points regardless misses the whole point. I don't really care about points, some weird meta-game. I care about what happens.

Anyway, I could go on and on. I think it will be a very good single-player game with a subscription, and I think most people will play it as such. As a fan of MMOs I'm worried about what its success might mean for the genre.

Posted: Aug 23rd 2011 2:13PM ghaste said

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@jealouspirate

I think the same thing as you.
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Posted: Aug 23rd 2011 10:48PM Bhima said

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@jealouspirate

Really excellent observation about SWTOR. This is basically how I feel about it as I have played the beta but you voiced my feelings perfectly. It does feel like a rather confused game in all of the respects you laid out.
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Posted: Aug 23rd 2011 2:06PM Malagarr said

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I can only say this: Not only will it succeed, it may very well be The WoW Killer we've all heard about...assuming many of the people who play WoW are willing to try a Sci-Fi setting.

Regardless, MMOs will never be the same again. Someone spilled RPG all over my MMO and SWTOR was the result...kinda like mixing chocolate and peanut butter...

mmm...chocolate and peanut butter...

~{ 8(o)...

Posted: Aug 23rd 2011 3:37PM Irem said

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@Malagarr
Emphasis on story is something that a lot of upcoming games have been going for independent of each other, not just TOR. It was a natural result of some of the major complaints about MMOs (lack of player involvement in the storyline, and shallow storytelling), the same way the experimentation with dynamic content a lot of games are doing is the result of complaints about a static world.

MMOs are never going to be the same, period. Too much is shifting in the upcoming crop of games to a completely different set of baseline expectations for what an MMO should include.
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Posted: Aug 23rd 2011 3:43PM Lucidus said

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@Malagarr I'll let you know if you're right.... right after I respond to this beta invite in my inbox. :p
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Posted: Aug 23rd 2011 3:56PM epilepticemu said

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@Irem

Irem, all of your comments are so logical, well-mannered, and . . . flat out ACCURATE that really, I have no idea that you're doing. This is the INTERNET. Stop messing with my perception of reality!
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Posted: Aug 23rd 2011 5:15PM OutThere said

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@Malagarr

RPG all over your MMO? This made me laugh. I remember when the acronym MMO was longer . . . hmmmmm. MMORPG

The roots of MMOs are in the RPG genre.
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Posted: Aug 24th 2011 8:53AM Malagarr said

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@Irem

Agreed. I know there are a number of MMOs heading this direction. It could be argued that AoC started it with the Tortage Island starting area. But they left the job largely unfinished. The difference is that SWTOR seems to have truly perfected it. And because of that, SWTOR will have a larger impact on the future of MMOs.
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Posted: Aug 24th 2011 8:56AM Malagarr said

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@OutThere

That's what I was hinting at. For the past several years its seemed like developers have been moving away from the RPG aspect of MMORPGs, though. I'm sure you'll recall all of the debates about whether or not they should even still be called MMORPGs, or if we should just start calling them MMOs.

SWTOR is putting the RPG back into MMORPGs. That said, as I compare SWTOR to the old time MMORPGs (EQ, for instance), there was very little RPG even in those games. SWTOR is setting a whole new standard.
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Posted: Aug 23rd 2011 2:16PM JuliusSeizure said

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I think it doesn't need to fail to avoid the problems you're concerned about, Eliot. What's needed is for something different to ALSO succeed.

Posted: Aug 23rd 2011 2:18PM Seldra said

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I'm not all that interested in swtor anymore, but I do hope that it along with gw2 succeed in their goals. It's rather boring having only one dominating mmo right now, and I hope that next year offers big changes to the landscape. I don't want wow killers I just want more market fragmentation.

Posted: Aug 23rd 2011 2:25PM Jagoss said

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How did you come across that information that Swtor has no player base? It just won the Gamescon as Best Online Game. Tor has already an incredible playerbase.

"all without having yet amassed a substantial playerbase"

I understand this is opinion..but your opinion is stating information. With no Oues and Quotes. Your reasoning is flawed big time. And I suggest reading the Massively report how WoW lost another 12 million Subscribers. Tor could very well be the wow killer.

Posted: Aug 23rd 2011 2:49PM willflynne said

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@Jagoss

For a game to have a substantial playerbase, it needs to have a good number of people playing the game.

TOR hasn't even been released yet.

It may have a substantial FANbase right now, but there isn't an actual playerbase yet.
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Posted: Aug 24th 2011 12:48AM j3w3l said

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@Jagoss
i really dont understand how a game can win a "best of "reward (unless its a best of show which it was not) with firstly not even being released and secondly many of its features not even being known or very well understood.

many of these rewards are influenced by the industry itself rather than on merit (ie bribes and such), not saying it wasn't rewarded well just saying to be wary
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Posted: Aug 23rd 2011 2:51PM chauncy said

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It's so, so weird.

I play a bunch of different games every week (I'm a very broad gamer and mainly game console) and while I do only tend to play one MMO at a time (due to RL restricting time) when I play them at all, I don't wish anything but the best for every other game out there. And yet here are all of these embittered MMO players who seem to want their genre to see failure after failure. It's absolutely bizarre.

I understand not being interested in something - I was never interested in Street Fighter 2 - but to go out of your way to just ****-talk it? A game? It's weird. Can somebody please explain it?

However the article was definitely food for thought.

Posted: Aug 23rd 2011 2:54PM Bolongo said

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@chauncy

There was an article on this very site a couple of weeks ago that discussed the psychology of this behaviour. Go find it. :)
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