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Reader Comments (15)

Posted: Jul 5th 2011 2:44PM The Minn said

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I just care about balanced PvP in MMOs, thats all i want.

Posted: Jul 5th 2011 5:38PM dragonandante said

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@The Minn
I'm in the same boat, but I feel it’s a dream that will never become reality. One problem is gear imbalances. A fellow in full epics verses a fellow in greens is hardly fair. You'd have to disable stat modifiers and such from gear when it comes to PvP. A lot of folks will still cry about it though even if it’s for fairness simply because they want the easy victory due to gear imbalance.

Next, there is the issue with classes. One class may be somewhat OP and then the rest complains till it gets nerfed. Then another class is now OP, and the cycle of buffs and nerfs continue. The only way to resolve that would be to have no classes, but more of a freeform skill based system somewhat like Ultima Online. This way if a particular skill is OP, they can't come crying to the Devs about fairness because they could've gone and obtained the skill themselves.

Lastly, you have the issue of level imbalances. The only solution I could think of is to scale your level back based on what zone you’re pvping in. For example let’s say you’re level 60, and you head to a level 30 zone. You’d be level 60 so long as you don’t engage in pvp, but the moment you do you’re scaled back to the level range of the zone. Or better yet you could be scaled to the level of whomever you’re attacking.

Yes, these are doable things, but unfortunately a lot of devs won’t take the chance due to the fickle nature of gamers.
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Posted: Jul 5th 2011 8:48PM Skyydragonn said

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@The Minn
The problem that prevents "True" PvP balance in any MMo is simple...the players. If they were to hand us a truly balanced PvP experience we would all be using the same weapons and armor, same spells, no stat modifiers, no extra class benefits or racial benefits..in short we'de be playing CoD...with swords and fireballs instead of bullets and grenades. And to be frank thats NOT what i want form my MMO gameplay...I have CoD for that type of play.
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Posted: Jul 6th 2011 11:58AM Space Cobra said

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@Tempes Magus

Dare I say it?

It seems, to me, the RPG aspects appeal to these players, too. By that, I mean specifically the "stat-building". In one sense, these people take time and a sense of pride building/gearing/grinding for levels and gear and then testing it out in PvP battle.

I have always wondered the same : Why don't these players go to CoD or some similar game and while they (and I) do, there is the same thing of "building your character" stat-wise and seeing them "grow" in level. (Which is Ironic when you think some of the more Hardcore PvPers like to gank or tear down Player Housing, hm? No empathy for them.) And, of course, there is the Pavlovian response/trap that we all fall for at times; chasing better gear or getting the "next level".

So, not so different from other players!
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Posted: Jul 5th 2011 3:32PM Rialle said

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According to the WoW forums:

"Fair" is when someone wins in PvP, or when someone gets epics easily.

"Unfair" is when someone else wins in PvP, or when someone has to work to get epics.

Posted: Jul 5th 2011 3:35PM (Unverified) said

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So, that piece makes some decent points, but only within the context of WoW/EQ/etc style MMORPG gameplay. For anyone like me, who doesn't like the whole level-progression-grind-raid-gear-etc style of play, its a storm in a bowl. A lot of those issues could disappear if MMO designers would show some creativity and not make the same game over and over again, with one or two things thrown in to claim uniqueness.

Posted: Jul 5th 2011 3:36PM Bramen said

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The article had some good points about fairness regarding time and money. But they barely mentioned that the level grind is time, and THAT'S how you are buying your P2P MMO. One chunk of time at a time. One month at a time.

If I pay for the time to play the game, and it takes me unaided 3 months to get to the endgame, then another 3 months for me to get board with the endgame and quit playing; that's 6 months total purchased game time. But if I pay a third party to "Skip" me past the grind and get to the endgame, that's 3 months less I will spend in the game, and it seems like game companies would lose money on that deal.

If time is money, and you are willing to pay someone to put in the time to level your character, then you clearly are not enjoying your time spent. I would advise finding a different game to play imho.

Posted: Jul 5th 2011 3:54PM bonkbonks said

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I never get tired of those MMO players and all their issues and complexes, always blaming everything on something or someone else and their obsession with balance or fairness, like if the world could be perfect for them

if it's not too much it is too little with them and every week there's a new hotfix for last week's hotfix

Posted: Jul 5th 2011 4:38PM KDolo said

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THIS SEE-SAW IS NOT BALANCED!

Posted: Jul 5th 2011 5:44PM (Unverified) said

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I'd just love to see an MMO that doesn't rely on the Raid treadmill for their 'end game'.

I'm sick of the stress, the greed, the anger, the fights and the whole deal with raiding. >_<

I want a true sandbox MMO... something where I can just have fun..help others...and just...be.






Posted: Jul 5th 2011 6:06PM Everfaust said

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@(Unverified) with all the articles here on Guild Wars 2, I'm surprised you haven't heard of it.

There is no "Raid Treadmill" or standard level progression.. the game is actually fun to play and very intuitive to cater to what the player wants, instead of just using a simple gimmick to cover up all that copy/paste crap that other mmo's can't seem to live without... yea, I'm looking at you Rift *(gear grind, raids, ect..)
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Posted: Jul 6th 2011 10:39AM (Unverified) said

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@Everfaust

Actually, I'm a huge GW1 fan. And I was very much looking forward to GW2. I'll likely buy GW2, but have been very disappointed in where Anet has gone. They've turned GW2 far more into a generic MMO than they've innovated with it. Sure, its got some nice things, but mostly its like RIFT, in that its very much a refinement and polishing of standard MMO mechanics into a slightly more rational set of mechanics.

Evolution of the genre it may be, but its very far from the revolution Anet's manifesto claims.
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Posted: Jul 5th 2011 10:43PM Jade Effect said

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It's an insightful read into the challenges the MMO developers face. It's also an interesting look at the law of unintended consequences.

Posted: Jul 6th 2011 12:56AM edgecrusherO0 said

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So, I skimmed through it. Am I the only one that noticed how there was some not-so-subtle WoW bashing throughout it?

Posted: Jul 6th 2011 7:56AM KDolo said

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my point is that players will scream imbalance when the reality is that it's usually the guy on the other end of the see-saw that's a lot fatter and not a problem with the see-saw itself.

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