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Reader Comments (22)

Posted: Jul 5th 2011 4:37PM KDolo said

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I didn't mind it in WAR. I won't mind it for TOR.

Posted: Jul 5th 2011 4:43PM BigAndShiny said

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Thing is, in an age where every other upcoming MMO is doing something with it's combat, SW:TOR is almost a relic of a bygone era, expecially considering both TSW and GW2 also have deep, fully voice-acted choice based stories, and much much more.


[Please don't hate. I will of course be playing TOR at launch]

Posted: Jul 5th 2011 4:58PM Space Cobra said

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Well, there is a possibility of mirroring in other classes, such as Counselors and Inquisitors, Knights and Warriors, and even Smugglers and Agents.

I think we've seen some differences, like Agents using more Sniping long-ranged weaponry with their cover-mechanic and Smugglers using pistols.

Thing is, I spotted these similarities awhile back (but, I'd say it was more a hunch I had from what I'd seen), and really, in a non-Lore or "it could've been lore at one point but Lucas went down a different path", this excites me because, really, there was not to be any special "Mandalore" race: Boba Fett was supposed to be an old "Shock Trooper" from the previous Imperial Army re-using his old gear (now that they had "Storm Troopers"). So, it's kinda a nice nerd, round-about nod to me to acknowledge this, even though it probably was intended to do something totally different.

Also, I keep thinking Michael Jackson is under one of the helmets in that pic!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oLXYiF_BdAs

Posted: Jul 5th 2011 5:10PM Faction 3 said

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Lately, all Im hearing about out of ToR is Vids & Interviews about the goddamn Bounty Hunters...

Posted: Jul 5th 2011 5:13PM Knuxson said

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I always had assumed that they would be fairly similar since because it seemed pretty obvious that each faction would need classes to have similar mechanics to the classes on the other faction. However, as Space Cobra said, even though they are mirrored there seems to be some subtle differences that will give playing the class counterparts their own feel. In addition to agents using snipers more while smugglers use pistols, sith inquisitors will use spells like force lightning while consulars will use more spells like force push. In the end it will probably seem like you are playing a class that, if not identical, seems very similar to the other faction's class. I think it will mostly be how the class abilities are presented that will make it feel different.

Posted: Jul 5th 2011 5:30PM Greyhame said

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Similarities are fine. As long as the abilities feel like they fit each class and not the other, then there's nothing really wrong with that. It makes sense as well that each side would have classes that fill similar roles.

Posted: Jul 5th 2011 5:46PM C Rose said

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Good insights there Larry. I do agree that there are mirrors and also that they don't really bother me much. They are after all only combat mechanics and role-defined mirrors and only slight at that.

One side-note I'd add is about the balance of the two factions, Republic and Sith, and how that will play out in expansions down the line.

I was involved in an in-depth discussion on the SWTOR forums about speculation on what they would do for expansion content, particularly race/class additions. After I considered it for a while it occured to me that Bioware is probably unlikely to introduce any new classes in the expansion, but they make take a page from WoW:BC and simply give each faction one of the opposing factions classes.

Now clearly that excludes any of the force-user classes because obviously Jedi and Sith aren't going anywhere, but Troopers and Smugglers for the Republic AND Agents and Bounty Hunters for the Empire I think could theoretically be supplanted in the opposing faction.

Now out of all those the two that I think would make the most sense from both a balance and lore perspective would definitely be the Imperial Agent (moving to a Republic Agent) and the Smuggler (moving to the Sith because of they're...let's say loose moral codes.)

While adding some new flavor for the first expansion, it also doesn't destroy balance because these two classes in essence fill the same roles as either DPS or Healing. Also lore-wise Smugglers clearly deal with both sides and tend to walk the line of "gray" anyways, while the Republic also has an Intelligence Agency which includes Republic "Spies" (ie. Agents).

Just an opinion but I'd be glad to hear what you all think.

Posted: Jul 5th 2011 5:49PM C Rose said

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EDIT: "because of THEIR...let's day loose moral codes."

Posted: Jul 5th 2011 8:01PM Decanus said

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ha love the use of frelling got to love farscapes replacement of certain words to get around watershed, anyone who doesnt like that is Fahrbot.

Posted: Jul 5th 2011 8:39PM eyeball2452 said

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I think this is trying to put a positive spin on a less than stellar Friday update and all it does is state the obvious. The closer we get to the supposed launch date/time frame with the NDA still up, the more concerned I become.

It also seems like the character progression is trending towards the tried and true model. TOR will be flashy, but the talent trees look pretty tired and the shared trees are a system that I wanted to see 5-6 years ago, but may not be a step in the wrong direction considering Rift's progression of mixing and matching calling/roles.

Like others have said, I do plan on buying the game around launch, but it's the lasting subscriptions (1 mo, 2 mo, etc) are what will determine the ultimate success of the game and I'm not sure it can live up to the hype.

Posted: Jul 5th 2011 10:11PM Bezza said

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I don't mind the similarites as long as the flavour is distinctly differant. I am just a bit miffed that both Bounty Hunters and Smugglers who are clearly not faction aligned classes are forced to play either sith or republic. Blast it! There should be a third faction for privateers who hold no allegance to either political entity and that is where bounty hunters, smugglers and pirates belong.

Posted: Jul 6th 2011 6:59AM Scrobes said

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@Bezza

I agree with this! To lock them down in such a way feels slightly funky.
Reply

Posted: Jul 6th 2011 1:35AM Ghostspeaker said

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In my opinion the classes seem just mirrored enough. That is, there's just enough similarity that there's not much risk of huge PvP imbalances between factions, but they're different enough that you wouldn't confuse them for twins in a dark room. There's a definite difference of style between the two, and that style translates into gameplay enough that it's good enough for me.

Posted: Jul 6th 2011 2:51AM (Unverified) said

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It's potentially a big headache for PvP balance if the different abilities just flat out make one class better. It seems like a BH actually could be a class you could build a team around ... pulling in priority targets, combining AoE CC + DPS, being able to actually liftoff the ground for attacks ... if it makes for stronger PvP teams, then the Republic are basically SOL.

I'm sure the Mythic/WAR pvp guys have been talking to Bioware about class mirroring concepts, but that was a game that saw people quit in droves because of how badly the classes were balanced

Posted: Jul 6th 2011 8:23AM (Unverified) said

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I disagree with @Unverified, it worked in WAR, it will work in TOR. I assumed from the bounce that they were going to fill similar roles. Yes, while I would have preferred something that more closely resembled a polished, HD-version of Pre-NGE SWG with gritty realism, sandbox feel and a 60-hour easter egg hunt before you get your first lightsaber, everyone wants a glowstick.

So this is what we got. An old saying comes to mind, "you get what you get so don't pitch a fit."

Posted: Jul 6th 2011 8:25AM (Unverified) said

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Also, speak for yourself please. As someone who beta tested for WAR and only played it for a few months after it released, I quit because the guys who developed WAR failed to deliver on what was at that time 1-2 major cities and 1-2 major classes they guaranteed would be good to go for launch. That was causing a lot of perceived balancing issues, but things still played out fairly well in RvR as far as what I participated in (and I was playing easily 30+ hours each week, mind you).

Posted: Jul 6th 2011 8:26AM (Unverified) said

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The whole GAME feels slightly funky, but both the developer and the concept are tried and true. I admit the graphics are still a bit too Cartoon Network for my taste (they are getting better, however, and the motion capture in part makes up for it).

Let's give TOR a chance (if it ever comes out this year).

Posted: Jul 6th 2011 9:50AM (Unverified) said

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"Also, speak for yourself please."


Take your own advice. I said it was a reason a lot of people quit, I didn't say it was the reason YOU quit.


Look at the patch notes, they tell a better story than you do.

Posted: Jul 6th 2011 10:07AM StampyIRL said

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It seems to me that they are giving each their own unique style and flavour, while allowing them to occupy the same niche within their respective factions. The Commando's heavy guns should make the AC feel significantly different than the Mercenary with its (lol teeny tiny) dual pistols.

I expect the same of classes like the Jedi Guardian and. the Sith Juggernaut in TOR. Remember the training on Dantooine and Korriban in the original KotOR? They felt pretty different thanks to the story and the setting, even though you're essentially doing the same thing - impressing a master, learning the code, etc.

Also, ME3 is supposed to have a much more fleshed out melee game. That won't radically change the mechanics, but having those extra options should add a bit of depth to the combat.

Posted: Jul 6th 2011 12:03PM goatfoam said

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I thought it was common knowledge that every class (every Advanced Class, even) had an opposite faction mirror.

Seems I was wrong.

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