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Reader Comments (29)

Posted: Jun 22nd 2011 2:47PM Dunraven said

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There needs to be a more sense of urgency to provide Non-raiders with a Viable end game...that is why RIFT is bleeding out subscribers right now.

Posted: Jun 22nd 2011 3:11PM Equillian said

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@Dunraven

lol - No. MOST people are still working on all the content provided... lets go over the list:

2 Level 50 Regular Dungeons
~5 Tier 1 Experts
~5 Expert Rifts
~5 Tier 2 Experts
2 or 3 Raid Rifts
10 man Slivers (1 right now, another coming soon)
20 man Greenscale
20 man River of Souls
and as of today, 20 man Hammerknell

... What did WoW have on month 6... Blackrock, took 8-9 months to get MC, the first REAL raid and heroics (Expert Dungeons) didnt come till BC (2.5yrs after launch).

Seriously... Chill out, have a drink, give up your self entitled behavior and relax buddy :)
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Posted: Jun 22nd 2011 3:33PM Anax said

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@Dunraven

What kind of endgame activities are you looking for? I am really curious about the range of existing endgame activities. It seems to me that the endgame in all of the games I've played (EQ2, LOTRO, Aion, STO, Rift) is all about grinding for some form of item or stat bonus. That bonus may be achieved through crafting, combat, PvP, collections, or achievements, but ultimately it always seems to come down to grinding for some kind of currency which is converted into better "stuff". When I reach that point, I get bored and quit.

EQ2 and LOTRO partly dodged "the grind" by having so many alternate advancement paths and so many cosmetic customization options (clothing, housing, mounts, etc.) that it took a long, long time for me to get bored. But eventually I did run out of fun things to do and (sadly), left the games.

Are there games with substantially more to do at the endgame than "grind"?
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Posted: Jun 22nd 2011 5:08PM Chambers said

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@Equillian

except for the fact that rift is not competeing with wow when it first launched, it is competeing with wow as it stands now, just as wow when it launched was not up against EQ2 from now.

The genre has moved on, and rift provides the same as what wow offers, but less of it.
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Posted: Jun 22nd 2011 7:48PM Rayko said

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@Equillian

I basically agree with you BUT MC and BWL were out before BC and, regardless of how easy they seem now, they were real raids.
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Posted: Jun 23rd 2011 2:02AM Rialle said

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@Chambers

I don't understand why people on Massively and WoWInsider say WoW has a lot more end game content than RIFT.

Both titles, as of RIGHT NOW, have a very comparable amount of content available at their current level caps. They have a very similar amount of 5-mans that are doable in heroic or expert mode, and a comparable amount of raid content.

Sure, if you cheat and add level 60, 70, and 80 end game content into WoW's total, it is going to seem like WoW has a lot more. However, like you said, RIFT is not competing against WoW of the past. It is competing against Cataclysm. End game from the old caps is irrelevant.

I will concede that WoW's instanced content, as of Cataclysm, is a tad more polished and less buggy than RIFT's.

What RIFT does better, however, is keeping the non-instanced world relevant to level capped players. I really wish that the developers would focus on this sort of game rather than WoW-style raid instances.

Comparing about quality of life stuff, like guild banks, to me isn't a big thing.
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Posted: Jun 22nd 2011 2:49PM Dril said

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Interesting, it was nothing new, but still quite a good read. But:

1) It seems Trion simply can't (or won't) try and make the solo progression at the level cap more interesting. I cringed when you mentioned they were implementing more dailies and more currencies.

Really? Are devs so stuck in the idea of dailies and currencies that they can't bring anything new to the table?

2) Nothing about housing at all from either of you? That's worrying and saddening.

3) I don't think his idea of taking classes from WoW as a starting point for people is a very good idea. At all. If I was playing a Marksman/Ranger in Rift and comparing it to the Hunter, I'd be asking:
-why can't I tame the creatures around me?
-why do I only have a tanking pet to begin with?
-why does that pet look the same all the time?
-why does my role play with exactly the same mechanics as a Rogue-esque soul combo, just from range?
-where's the flair (traps, stings, aspects, buffs) that isn't purely about doing damage?

I think it's absolutely the wrong approach. You should point out that it's up to you to make what you like, not to try and ape another game's class (and fall well short of the mark) and then try and change it slightly.

Posted: Jun 22nd 2011 3:42PM Lucien said

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@Dril

I wish Trion would tip their hand about something other than raiding. I know I'm not anywhere near the average gamer having cleared out all of the tier 1 and tier 2 dungeons in the first week, but I have no interest in the raiding endgame and once I've been through a dungeon, there's usually not much of a reason for me to go back. Gear grinds, faction grinds, these things don't interest me anymore.

I love the rate at which Trion is producing content, I just wish they'd produce something other than what we've seen before in every other game.
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Posted: Jun 22nd 2011 8:23PM Haldurson said

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@Dril
"1) It seems Trion simply can't (or won't) try and make the solo progression at the level cap more interesting.:
You obviously just skimmed the article and didn't actually read it. It says SPECIFICALLY that they are addressing casual play at the level cap in a future release.

"2) Nothing about housing at all from either of you? That's worrying and saddening."

That's actually been addressed in podcasts and that it is coming, but it's simply not their highest priority. The interview DOES hint at it though where it addresses content for roleplayers.

"3) I don't think his idea of taking classes from WoW as a starting point for people is a very good idea"

Again, you didn't actually read the article. What they are saying is that some new comers are having difficulty understanding the soul system. Since a lot of Rift's players are coming from WoW, They just want to put it into a context that those people already understand. If you have a better idea, say it. It sounds more like all you have are criticisms, but no actual ideas of a better way of solving the problem.
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Posted: Jun 23rd 2011 4:08AM Dril said

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@Haldurson

Wow. Talk about not reading and a failure to understand.

1) It says SPECIFICALLY that they're adding new dailies and a new currency. Which, if you read my comment, you would see was my point. READ THINGS.

2) Nowhere IN THIS ARTICLE did they explicitly mention housing, and a vague hint at "things for roleplayers" could mean anything. New emotes, for instance.

3) Err, yes, that's exactly what they're doing: trying to get people from WoW to build a class they remember. Which is a bad idea, for reasons I pointed out, because Rift cannot compete straight-up with WoW's classes and, in the case of the Hunter example, shows up some of Rift's weaknesses when it come to choice, versatility and flair.

You'll note I did offer a solution (OH BUT I THOUGHT YOU WERE AGAINST SKIM-READING): emphasise the customisation and ability to build whatever you want, but don't encourage people to just try and build what they know.

I'm genuinely staggered at how little you read of my comment but then proceeded to berate me for raising (perfectly valid) points. Amazing, truly amazing.
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Posted: Jun 22nd 2011 2:57PM Mikkhail said

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You know ... I have tried Rift ... Then I tried it again ... and for all its slick spit and polish (it is really good) I just can't get into it. There is just nothing about it I can really imerse myself into (***that's just me***). It seems to have the depth of a rain puddle.

I am realizing that my post-WoW MMO playing has been wandering from one MMO to another finding nothing that I can really "get into" ... it all seems very generic ... I need a mythos and backstory that I can sink my teeth into and really imerse myself in. Maybe I should stick to the F2P titles until TSW drops ... that is the one out there that looks like it could have the depth, backstory and mythos that can finally really grab me.

Posted: Jun 22nd 2011 3:43PM (Unverified) said

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@Mikkhail

I've hit my post-WoW time nearly the same way, though not trying many MMO's. I played the Guild Wars trial recently, and despite some issues, I found it fun and refreshing enough to order the full game. It's nice to know I won't have a subscription looming over my head making me feel bad if I'm not in the mood to play. Good luck finding a game to tide you over!
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Posted: Jun 22nd 2011 4:31PM Nepentheia said

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@Mikkhail

Rift inherently doesn't have much TO get into other than the very combat-oriented basics. While I can understand the 'war-torn world under siege' dynamic, it is a fairly narrow focus and it doesn't do much at all for creating a fully-actualized, immersive, "liveable" game WORLD.
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Posted: Jun 23rd 2011 6:28AM JuliusSeizure said

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@Mikkhail

I think where they really dropped the ball was giving us these fascinating cultures in the Defiant, then sticking them with the hopelessly generic fantasy early zones of Freemarch and Stonefield. Even their capitol, Meridian, doesn't do anything to show off their character.
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Posted: Jun 22nd 2011 3:28PM (Unverified) said

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I think the integration of cross-server LFG would absolutely undermine everything they are trying to do. The LFG system as-is provides a handy tool for me to use when I want to ... decreasing queue times would only make the playerbase think that LFG was the 'premiere' way to level, increase general asshattery, and squash any sort of server unity. Right now I usually have to wait upwards of an hour (shaman dps), but that gives me tons of time to go quest, up my crafting, etc etc. I'd prefer to wait and queue only with folks from Dimroot. 'Course, that's just my personal opinion though.

Posted: Jun 22nd 2011 7:18PM Protheus said

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I have started playing Rift a week ago. In that time I got a cleric to 34. In that time span I only did 2 dungeons and those were not the one form the LFG tool. Each time I log in to the game my LFG tool is active (cleric healer) and sofar nothing.

So in my opinion they should implement a cross-shard LFG tool, so I can atleast do some dungeon runs before I get way to bored with only quest and doing rifts.

p.s. same is for warfronts
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Posted: Jun 22nd 2011 3:39PM (Unverified) said

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@Puremallace

Exactly! Though you know someone's going to call it a marketing spin or a flat-out lie. It's good that we got word from Trion about it to explain to people what was really going on.

Posted: Jun 22nd 2011 3:57PM real65rcncom said

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Yo Dawg,

I heard you like raiding with your raiding, so I put some raids (experts) inside yo raids so you can raid while you raid.

Posted: Jun 22nd 2011 6:10PM winterborn said

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@Puremallace

I think we all know this is PR BS.

We have seen the deleted posts on population counts and until Trion puts up or shuts up on server cap/population, it is just more BS.

We all knew this was the big problem (small server caps) and I think they should have the money and time to get the hardware and software up to par for a MMO server now. But PR BS wont fly they need to provide data and the transfer/trial spin sounds fishy.

At least they are rolling out content.

Posted: Jun 22nd 2011 6:32PM psycros said

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Rift has so many bugged quests I lost count. The soul system is a total joke..every calling has at least three useless souls. The constant invasions actually start becoming very tiresome after a while, esp. when their getting in the way of questing. And naturally, the only way to get decent gear is PvP, which is also the fastest leveling by far - WTH, Trion? I can do every quest in a zone and barely get 2nd rank with a faction, but a single dungeon run and I'm maxed: gee, where have I heard THAT before? I could go on but there's no point..its clear from this article that Rift will never be anything but a WoW clone. Rift brought a couple new ideas to the table, but the sheer amount of content and game mechanics "borrowed" from WoW, combined with the bugs and annoyances were just too much.

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