| Mail |
You might also like: WoW Insider, Joystiq, and more

Reader Comments (33)

Posted: Jun 20th 2011 4:27PM Calfis said

  • 1 heart
  • Report
Love them or hate them, one thing is for sure HYDRA is god damn PRO

Posted: Jun 20th 2011 4:32PM oddshrub said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
CCP prides themselves of this tournament but really, they had maybe 10.000 viewers, didn't even air all the fights and let cheating go unpunished.

Same weekend at dreamhack the league of legends team have the streams with 100.000 people wathcing, showing all matches, having no cheating and real competition because people who actually care about winning.

CCP should be ashamed. Sure you can allow metagaming, but whats the point of having a tournament where every fight is fixed?

It's not overly surprising of course, in last years travesty there was a lot of metagaming as well, what s surprising is that they have any viewers or sponsors left at all.

Posted: Jun 20th 2011 5:52PM Brendan Drain said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
@oddshrub They had a record 28,000 viewers, but it could easily have been made higher. The timing of the tournament was a bit off, it coincided with Dreamhack when a lot of people were watching other online tournaments. They could really have pushed the esports angle through some kind of presence or promotion at Dreamhack, but didn't. The tournament also came right after E3 so the build-up to it got displaced by big E3 news.

Regarding cheating and the meta game, that's really part of EVE and it's not something that can be taken away even if you wanted it to. There's no way to prove Team X fed intel to Team Y, or Team X spied on Team Y. The meta game also goes both ways -- the teams being spied on could easily have practiced fake builds to throw opponents off, or could have practiced builds with an obvious counter and then come in with a completely different setup. The teams that won this year practiced in secret inside a wormhole to avoid spying. It's really all down to the players and how they manage the meta game.
Reply

Posted: Jun 20th 2011 6:03PM (Unverified) said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
@oddshrub

Oh dear reader, how you missed the point entirely.

This metagame is not cheating. You call it cheating because you don't know any better, and for some reason need to label the actions as something abominable.

"Know thy enemy" is not cheating, it is just being smart, and these two alliances played brilliantly. There is nothing in the rules against spying to get that information (especially before the tournament even began) or against collaborating with other alliances to stack matches. Do you honestly have yourself convinced that this DOESN'T happen in other E-Sports? Because trust me, it does.

Knowing your enemies' strategies is paramount to winning in any game, especially in E-sports. Although the players usually don't have to resort to spying in order to get that intel, learning the other primary competitors' strategies and knowing how to beat them isn't just a good idea, it's mandatory.

The simple fact is that espionage is a long-standing traditional part of the game. That these other alliances, especially veterans like the former champions Pandemic Legion, left themselves so vulnerable to such information gathering prior to the tournament is shameful.

Congratulations to the winners!
Keep making scrubs cry for me, gentlemen. It never gets old.
Reply

Posted: Jun 21st 2011 12:17PM Kalex716 said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
@(Unverified)

Agreed,

In fact this does more to propel it more towards professionalism than anything else.

You don't think high profile teams in sports should watch game tape to prepare for upcoming matchups? This things are not "supposed" to happen, but they do, and its accepted.

This is all at the very nature of competition. People that want to win bad enough, always look for that edge. And in true sporting tradition, those who work closest to it are either champions, or cross it too much and get called cheaters.
Reply

Posted: Jun 20th 2011 7:32PM Graill440 said

  • 1 heart
  • Report

Three quarters of the way through myself and friends knew what was happening, we tuned out. CCP acknowledges a win, thats all.

@Eve scrubs, the ones that think they are hardcore"playahs" manipulating lack of game mechanics, pathetic. You keep standing on your soapbox of "metagame" is the shit. Until the "metagame" has a counter to real life trust verse game mechanics you hardcore scrubs will always be the defenders of shit gameplay, like your tourny.

There fact is this, the tourney was manipulated and the end result was an artificial win, regardless of how it was achieved. No glory other than the people involved showed they have TAP and can cheat (using the word metagame to justify the result), what a legacy. And of course throwing the metagame spin around to justify actions since their are no controls ingame to counter real life interaction out of game makes it all viable.

The big suprise was CCP not stepping in, thats a good thing, glad they just sat back and let it happen as this is what they tout EVE is all about, letting players destroy their game for them. They get a kudos for this, though i would bet they were shaking their heads at some point knowing the bed was wrinkled.

The thing with hardcore scrubs in eve is they know that CCP will not implement ingame mechanics to counter the real life trust and spying that is needed to achieve tourny fixes like the groups in question did, the scrubs know that CCP would lose the few players they have left, knowing one side of the coin will never be able to counter certain player actions is what the scrubs count on and why eve has such a small community, such that it is.

just to be clear for you EVE scrubs, your metagame spin is simple dishonestly with no ingame counter, a no win, and..a no brain for players doing it. Sad Showing.

Lets see what you scrubs come up with in defense, its a sanbox? I can use real life trust to spy, its fine and call it metagame? Just because eve has no counter to stop my "metagame" doesnt make me a bad person? Come on, lets see the holier than thou retorts. (Grin) too funny.

Posted: Jun 21st 2011 3:57AM Stellar25 said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
@Graill440 I thought that Eve could use a police faction that players could join. This could include fighting criminals and perhaps jail time? Maybe an auto punt to low/null sec. If they are going to allow players to sandbox as criminals and the underbelly of society, they should allow the opposite.
Reply

Posted: Jun 20th 2011 11:01PM Ragemaster9999 said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
nobody i Know in EVE takes the tournement seriously anyway. Its artifical pvp, and isnt what happens on a day to day basis.Its really just a gimmick tbh

Posted: Jun 21st 2011 12:49AM Verus said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
I donĀ“t quite understand. I thought this tournament was separate from the normal eve server and was about who the best players are ?

Posted: Jun 21st 2011 4:14PM Mcgreag said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
@Verus The tournament are played on the regular server and all ships and modules used have to be obtained by normal ingame means.
The purpose of the tournament has never been to show who is the best pilots but who is the "best" alliance. That's why it's called the Alliance Tournament and not something else.

Also note that "best" here does not have to mean the best combat pilots but who is best at the combined effort needed to win, this includes funding, logistics, training, spying and finally meta gaming.
But in the end meta gaming is just one of the many components to make a good team. It would mean nothing if someone brought a good enough team to beat them. Fact of the matter is that no other team where good enough to beat them.
Reply

Posted: Jun 21st 2011 1:27AM Tantabobo said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
How is spying any different than football teams studying film before a game? The entire idea is to get an idea of how your opponent will play so that you can have a better chance at beating them. This is done in other online games as well. The top Starcraft players view matches from their opponents to see how they play, how they defend from a rush, etc... so that they can gain the upper hand. This is a part of life.

@Tempes Magus
I fail to see how you can call all of the matches rigged. I will admit that there were at least 4 that you can call rigged (during the group stages, no idea about the prelim rounds) but last I checked there were a fair few more games than that.

All that being said, it is a shame that the final match ended the way that it did, but honestly, it was more entertaining than the PL v. Hydra match from last year.

Posted: Jun 21st 2011 3:48AM Stanimir said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
Whoever said it broke their immersion must be really butthurt about this. If you've ever read "The Empyrean Age" novel that was published by CCP, there is a character who literally changes formed threw cloning and essentially bones the entire Caldari State and Gallente Federation. Capsuleers (us) are literally unkillable gods compared to ordinary people. The idea of capsuleers throwing a match to gain more money for themselves is absolutely positively within the lore. It quite honest deepens my immersion, to know that I can only count on myself.

Posted: Jun 21st 2011 9:46AM Wizardling said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
The result: the most pathetic and boring final match I have ever seen in any e-sport in my entire life, and that's saying something (let's face it - many e-sports still struggle to make decent viewing).

Even CCP couldn't be bothered to talk about it and immediately switched topics after it was over. There has also been a resounding lack of CCP publicity over the result. I think that says it all really.

Frankly I doubt I'll bother staying up all night next tournament if it's going to be more crap like this. I want to be entertained. Instead viewers and CCP got a giant finger from Hydra/Outbreak. Way to go guys. You're just too cool for me, I guess.

Featured Stories

One Shots: Hello, autumn

Posted on Oct 19th 2014 10:00AM

Engadget

Engadget

Joystiq

Joystiq

WoW Insider

WoW

TUAW

TUAW