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Reader Comments (34)

Posted: Jun 16th 2011 10:45AM real65rcncom said

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Poopsockers and Neckbeards are about to revolt.

How DARE you charge them for necessary tools for their elite raiding they can't design themselves, but NEED for raiding... AND make them pay for it too?

The terrorists will win if you do this.

Posted: Jun 16th 2011 11:07AM Silverangel said

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The added value of community additions achieves value for the game by virtue of being freely generated by the community. If it's a money-making proposition like an item database or a DPS plugin required for raiding, and you're going to make people pay, then the developer should just do it themselves and charge extra for it. But wait, wouldn't players go into a frenzy over that? This is the same bitter pill to swallow as a F2P store where you can pay for advantage, and it would drive me away from any game.

Posted: Jun 16th 2011 11:12AM Bladerunner83 said

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I'm going to say that there has to be an educated decision on which add-ons should require payment and which shouldn't. The WOWhead database is awesome and it would be really awesome if someone came up with that idea for every other MMO I play. If these simple add-on development groups get paid for the work they do, then maybe they can spend more time on the project and improve it; or even work on different improvement projects for other games. Some ideas might be so badass that the game development company picks them up to contribute more cool ideas into the mix. Nobody likes paying more for anything, but common people, you see where free gets you? Unless you truly are a giving person then you know you're not going to sit down and develop an updated item database for your favorite game, then give it out for free; All that work for nothing but recognition.

Posted: Jun 16th 2011 11:48AM wfseg said

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@Everyone

Here's the link from Massively on the Eve thing:
http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/06/15/third-party-development-acquiring-monetization-options-from-eve/

Quote:
"The entry itself goes into more details on the restrictions of the program and what it will mean for non-commercial sites (which will not be required to pay any sort of fee)."

Not required to pay any sort of fee, but....

Go on the Eve site itself (http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=901)

Quote:
"For ad-supported ventures, we require that licensed applications or services not be associated with ISK selling/buying, macros or bots. An example of unacceptable monetization would be accepting Google AdWords from sites violating our EULA and ToS. (this is essentially similar to our terms for fansites)"

or simply quoting the question below it:
"Will website ads require a commercial license?
Yes, for ad-supported websites you will require a commercial license."

=__=

It's debatable tactics, that's why everyone's debating about it. My opinion, I don't like it. It's like a book publisher who wants to charge for fanfics.

Posted: Jun 16th 2011 11:52AM halfcaptain said

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@Dril

1) 'lil sore, huh?

2) wahhhhh i did my research and youuu didn'tttt. Calm down. I know it costs more in Europe, but it's complicated, and that is an unfortunate side effect of the economic climate over there. Not to mention the fact the Iceland isn't yet a part of the EU. My point, really, is that saying EVE is the MOST EXPENSIVE MMO is just plain wrong, and that EVE's payment system, unlike many others, has options. But if you did your research, you would know that, right? That many players in the UK buy GTC in US via paypal and end up paying the same damn price.

3) You can't read very well, can you? These items are not 'RMT exclusive.' They are 'Aurum' exclusive. You didn't actually click those links, did you? Once it's introduced, you can convert your purchased PLEX to Aurum, and use Aurum to purchase the items. Before you start raging about how someone somewhere has to spend some amount of money to get some something, I know. I am fully aware that there is money involved. There will always be people buying plex with cash, and these same people will throw it on the market to get some space money. I never claimed otherwise. What you don't seem to get is that it's possible, nay, easy to pay your subscription and buy these items without using real money. Every single capsuleer in the eve universe can't do it, sure, but that's not going to happen, and that doesn't change the fact that you can remain subbed and viable in the cash shop with ISK alone. I don't know why you can't get your head around that.

By the way, it is a 'player-driven' economy, not 'player-controlled.' There's a difference. Ask me why! I've got some articles for you to not read.

Posted: Jun 16th 2011 12:19PM Dril said

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@halfcaptain

Ah, right, so it's totally wrong despite the fact that it is provably the most expensive MMO to sub to (who mentioned game time cards?) from Britannia? Mmmmm. Special definitions of wrong and right are being employed methinks.

I'm going to spell it out for you very simply, so you understand why it's exclusive:

Aurum comes from PLEX.
PLEX cannot be produced, mined, manufactured or otherwise created within the game. It can only be bought with real money at its source. The source will only give you PLEX if you give it real money. Only real money can be used to acquire it from the source. It can be traded for ISK, sure. But it can only be produced with real life money.

Thus, Aurum has a real life monetary value. Comprendé? Is this easy enough to understand?

Now, because certain items can only be brought INTO the system with Aurum, they are RMT-exclusive. It doesn't matter that you can trade them. It doesn't matter that you can acquire them from other players for ISK. It is purely available on an RMT basis. Extra money has to be paid for somewhere to acquire it initially. So, yes, it's RMT exclusive.

Feel free to link those articles. I'm sure you'll have totally misunderstood them as well, since advanced topics like, say, anything beyond "I R CAN BUY DIS FOR ISK LOL IT R NOT FROM $$" seem to be a bit too difficult to grasp.
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Posted: Jun 16th 2011 1:09PM halfcaptain said

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@Dril

Wow, man. Backed into a corner, and now you've gotten real nasty. We were perfectly clear on how PLEX worked before your kindly broke it down for us. I know that PLEX needs to come from somewhere. I also know that somewhere isn't a moon, or an NPC corp, or a POS out in null. Yes, PLEX comes from one direction, cash. At no point was I confused about this, and nowhere did I argue otherwise. All I'm saying, for the last time, is that the items you can purchase with Aurum are not only accessible with real cash, but with ISK from in-game sweat and tears. Yes, the PLEX is coming from one direction, people purchasing them with real cash and putting them on the market. No, that does not mean I am forced to spend my money on the PLEX I purchase with ISK I've earned in game. I get what you're trying to say, but just because Joe spent $70 on PLEX and sold it Barry for 340m ISK doesn't mean Barry has spent $70 of real cash. Yes there is a monetary value, and yes, if you want to play games, we are all RMTing all the time, but the end result of Joe-Barry exchange is that Barry spent no real money. Here is an article for you:

ex•clu•sive
   [ik-skloo-siv, -ziv] –adjective

1. not admitting of something else; incompatible: mutually exclusive plans of action.

Get it? A real money trading EXCLUSIVE cash shop would mean that I'm spending $$ on space clothes. Functionally, I've said this before, Barry isn't spending any real money; he is spending the ISK he worked hard for, and he is spending the same ISK to keep subbed.

How you doing, still all fired up?
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Posted: Jun 16th 2011 1:10PM halfcaptain said

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@halfcaptain

*you kindly broke it down for us.

being able to edit would be so boss.
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Posted: Jun 16th 2011 1:17PM Dril said

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@halfcaptain

I think we've repeated this same argument at least twice (if not thrice now.) It's going nowhere. Let's agree to disagree, partially because I have curry I need to eat and partially because both of us repeating the same thing over and over is pointless.

Also: yes, an edit button would be boss.
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Posted: Jun 16th 2011 11:58AM halfcaptain said

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@Dril

By the way, i'm leaving the rest of your last post alone because it barely makes sense.

Posted: Jun 16th 2011 12:17PM bleyzwun said

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First of all. I don't like databases. That doesn't mean I don't use them when I need to, but it really takes away from games.

Also, I don't like the idea of charging people to use these tools. There is noway in hell that I would pay to use something like thottbot or wowhead. If all of these were charging, I can guarantee that someone will take the information, then release to download through torrent or some other way.

Posted: Jun 16th 2011 2:19PM Valdamar said

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Unless a website/app has become almost essential to enjoying/playing an MMO, I think starting to charge for it is just going to drive away 95% of the people using it.

I guess not charging for it and making money from ads is ok, but too many ads can drive people away too, especially with all the malware rubbish that can get loaded on your PC by ads these days.

Posted: Jun 16th 2011 3:20PM runzwithsizzorz said

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I don't have much of an issue with what CCP is trying to do, save for a couple of points.

CCP can do whatever they want with their IP and requiring licensing for an application that will be sold on the Apple, Google, etc, market, falls within their rights. Its not an exorbitant fee, and the rules are very open, but they may do well to provide a little more support and tools to those who want them. Requiring fansites to pay the same $99 is a bit of a stretch.

The first developer tier should pay $99. I am more than positive that the developers that are crying crocodile tears over this whole issue, will be replaced by the developers who see this as an opportunity to put a $1.99 app on The Apple Store and get it to sell 10,000 times. Even 1000 times makes the deal worthwhile. In fact, make it 500 times!!!

But CCP lumps fansites in with the tier 1 developers. The fansite is what my son has. He created a simple fansite advertizing his corp, but then also linked Shattered Crystal. According to CCP, his fansite should pay $99 for the year since he may make a profit of a couple of pennies should someone click the link and buy game time. This type of site should be placed in a different tier; maybe not a non-commercial license, but a much lower fee scale.

Then there are the sites that provide apps but only ask for ISK donations. This is a tricky one because ISK does have real monetary value. Even though it can only really be used to re-up game time, its worth $15 for about every 400,000 ISK. But these sites use the ISK to ease game payments, thereby using that $15 for hosting.

I think that there is a really great opportunity to be able to once again get some really great quality apps for the iPhone and Android. I use a Mac and have been dying to get my hands on better quality apps, but developers lost their incentive some time ago. If CCP expands their tier system then I think this could all work.

Posted: Jun 17th 2011 3:28PM EgoPoisoning said

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I like the idea of EVE doing it.

I don't -play- EVE. However, it constantly makes its way into my field of view for the innovative ways CCP handles things like RMT and addressing player concerns. EVE is an MMO that I feel can "get away" with doing bold things that would create nothing but horror were another MMO to try them; once the new approaches are out in the world, though, both players and developers have a chance to determine if they'd like to see those things in other games.

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