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Reader Comments (57)

Posted: Jun 3rd 2011 7:07PM DrewIW said

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One of the neat things about Rift was that it didn't come with all the ancillary bullshit that made WoW so unbearable.

Since it looks like you'll have to put up with all of that now, you might as well just play WoW since it has more content and shorter queues.

Posted: Jun 3rd 2011 7:52PM Darkkhorse said

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@DrewIW I'm not sure what you are talking about since you can't even create a macro with 2 skills on the same GDC. Could you link the article or tutorial that you are speaking about?

I wish there was a way to combine skills into one macro for this game, however, it will not work since most skills share the same GDC. So, whatever skill/attack you program first will be the only one that ever fires off.
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Posted: Jun 3rd 2011 8:54PM (Unverified) said

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@Darkkhorse
Get a keyboard with built-in macros, like MS Sidewinder X4. I can cast all the Bard motiffs using one key... the entire rotation for a bard is hooked to one key.
You don't need an API for this... and it's legal if you are in front of the screen (not botting)
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Posted: Jun 3rd 2011 10:22PM dudemanjac said

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@DrewIW Or you can just not use the "ancillary bullshit." And really? Ques? I haven't had that problem since start or for that wacky event a month ago.
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Posted: Jun 3rd 2011 7:12PM Dril said

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I assume a lot of people will be up in arms over things like dps meters and/or gearscore (the latter of which has seen a staggering decrease in use on my WoW server since Cata's release.) This happened in LOTRO as well, and I admit I did /popcorn a few times.

Personally, I think a lot of people misunderstand meters in particular. They look at WoW's crap group etiquette, see that WoW has dps meters, put two and two together and get three; WoW's groups suck for a myriad of reasons, and, frankly, meters aren't top of the list.

Besides that, parsers have existed for a good long time, so it's nothing special.

Also, regarding complexity: Rift is a game where you can make macros do basically all the work for you (I'm not even exaggerating, there are several examples of this in the Blogosphere and class forums) and I highly doubt addons will make it any more basic, other than a DBM-style mod.

Roll on addons. If RIFT has to be a success, it might as well prove that addons are a great addition, not a tool for bad players to fall back on.

Posted: Jun 3rd 2011 10:32PM Ghostspeaker said

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@Dril

Yeah, I remember parsers and such back in EQ days and their community sure didn't go all Lord of the Flies the way WoW has. I don't get what all the fuss is about.
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Posted: Jun 3rd 2011 11:30PM Utakata said

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@Dril

I beg to differ. They are at the top of everyoones mind in anything that is group instance in WoW. And the primary reason for the use and abuse of /vote kick. Thus in utilizing a one Christopher Hitchens' quote, "Damage meters poisons everything."

Case in point: Right now, I'm looking at RIFT as an alternative to WoW....as I am planning to leave WoW after 6 years of unfettered dedication. One of the main reasons being the intrusiveness of said meters is at a all time high. If Trion opens RIFT to that same spectacle that has turned WoW into unenjoyable and festering pool of social delinquency, I won't be playing RIFT either. So Trion has a choice, either limit damage meters to a personal individual bases (meaning you can only run it on yourself) or have them banned outright. Or some of us interested players will be voting with our wallets instead.
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Posted: Jun 4th 2011 3:04AM Mynsc said

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@Utakata

Meters are only a problem for the poor players that dont care about playing their class at a decent level and want to get boosted through dungeons / raids.

So basically what you're saying is "omg down with the meters because they show how weak I am at playing my class... they're evil!!!!" Getting them out of the game is not gonna fix any problems... it's just going to hide them. And when they're hidden... they become bigger.

I've been a dps for a long long time in WoW and have never been kicked from a group because of meters... you could say I'm lucky or you could say that they are useful and fun for everyone except the slackers that want to get boosted.
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Posted: Jun 4th 2011 5:11AM Dril said

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@Utakata

Who is this "everyone" you speak of (I could make a quip about its spelling but it's too early for such shenanigans) and how often have you, personally, kicked someone because their dps was so low?

In 3 years of tanking and healing I've never given the meters more than a passing thought. In situations where it really matters, I might, once or twice, have asked someone to up their dps so that the encounter could be, you know, beaten.

Your idle threats really mean nothing. As I said, there are far worse things that plague WoW and cause crap groups, namely cross-server dungeons, over-emphasising rewards and piss-poor progression design (i.e. heroics should be easier than they are now, but raids should get progressively harder, not easier.)

There are a myriad of reasons to not play RIFT. Addons aren't on that list of reasons.
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Posted: Jun 4th 2011 9:53AM JuliusSeizure said

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@Dril

It's more like putting two and blancmange together and getting CALAMITY! ;)
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Posted: Jun 4th 2011 2:49PM Utakata said

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@Mynsc

What a load of clap trap, Mynsc. I suspect you believe that because you think games are a job...where everyone should pull their weight or hit the highway. But I digress...

...I have yet to see how damage meters make WoW fun in any sense other than showing how much one has stoked it. Most of time it's used outside of personal reasons to berate and humiliate others who maybe struggling. That's it...your hypothetical "evil players" that you claim want to be "carried." I have yet in my 6 years have to meet such a player. Most at worst have been struggling as I've said or incompetent...nothing as odious as what you're suggesting.

Not to mention the insinuation of those who are critical of such meters must themselves being doing bad thus not wanting to be exposed. Strawman much? Which only proves to me that it appears that damage meters have already poisened your mind.

@Dril

Yes...sure, attack one's spelling (or simple typo in this case) instead debating what is one has said is sure way of avoiding the criticisms all together. But I digress...

Whose everyone I ask? Let me ask you then which playesr' mind is it not on? The ones that are blissfully unaware such 3rd party meters exist in WoW? I haven't ran into any of those yet. But I am speaking from a likely conscious level based on probability...if you have information that's contrary on that, I am all ears. I could be wrong. But I strongly suspect I am right.

I have never kicked anyone because their dps is too low nor have I ever complained. I tend to work and adapt to any situation when it comes to grouping, raiding, PuG'ing etc. If the group is not working out, I kindly remove myself and go to another. I'm not hired to police other's dps or their contribution (or lack there-of). I'm there to enjoy the game. But I am not sure what your point is on that.

As for the threats, they're not. It is instead something I will naturally do and follow threw on. I've already seen what a horrible place WoW has become because inpart these so called meters, I will not play another game that wants to go there. /shrug
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Posted: Jun 4th 2011 7:33PM Dril said

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@Utakata

Well, you'll note that I actually did answer you in addition to *not* making a quip about the spelling, but if reading comprehension isn't your thing, go nuts.

I'm putting my hand up as someone who didn't constantly have meters on their mind. That's not everyone, is it? Speaking from a "likely concious level" and "strongly suspecting" you're right do not, sadly, a valid argument make. If you're simply applying hearsay to everyone, then, well, I don't think there's any point continuing this debate/

Suffice to say, threatening to leave a game because of a feature that may or may not be bad is fairly ridiculous in my mind, but it suggests to me that you'd rather live in the belief that you're right rather than be proven wrong. Regardless, just because you think they ruined WoW (which they didn't) doesn't mean they'll ruin RIFT, since there are several key differences in the makeup of the playerbase and the tech in the games.
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Posted: Jun 3rd 2011 7:14PM jealouspirate said

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Personally, I don't think this is a good idea. If you take WoW, the most similar example, addons have really caused a lot of negatives in that game.

1) It creates a complexity arms race between developers and modders. You make a mod that makes an encounter easy, so they develop a more complex encounter since everyone is uses the mod, and so on. Now if you want to raid in WoW 3rd party addons that track everything to the microsecond are all mandatory since encounters are designed assuming you'll use them.

2) They can completely change the culture of the game in a way the developers never intended. Again in WoW, addons like DPS meters and Gearscore had absolutely massive (negative) impacts on player culture and community that Blizzard had little control over.

3) It allows, if not encourages, developers to slack off on their own default UI. WoW's default UI was absolutely insufficient for years, and still is, but it didn't really matter since everyone used addons anyway so Blizzard was able to let it slide.

Posted: Jun 3rd 2011 7:22PM jealouspirate said

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@jealouspirate

Replying to myself,

4) Similar to point 2, it takes a degree of control away from Trion. Without addons they control how people play, and to a degree their expectations. With addons suddenly you can have players demanding features from addons and now your development course is altered, perhaps in a way you don't want. Blizzard has actually had to spend development time breaking addons that they feel 'cross the line', or to incorporate popular addon features into their UI.
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Posted: Jun 4th 2011 12:03AM entropyboy said

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@jealouspirate
i agree.
all perfect points.

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Posted: Jun 4th 2011 7:51AM MMOaddict said

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@jealouspirate

How does it make them lazy when 6 years later, half of the stuff built by addon makers is now officially part of the game? It's smart, not lazy.
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Posted: Jun 3rd 2011 7:17PM Brendan Drain said

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If they didn't develop an API to support addons, people would make them anyway. People have already worked out how to inject code into the client to potentially do what they could more easily achieve with a decent addon framework..

Posted: Jun 3rd 2011 7:29PM Oskari said

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What I'd like to see Trion do is more of an Apple Appstore format, wherein either Trion creates various addons, or allows users to create and then approves said addons. This would alleviate (hopefully) broken addons whenever a major patch is installed. Also, I'd like to be able to, while in game, search and apply addons on the fly.

This current format gets really messy, especially if you come to rely on an addon that someone decides to no longer support.

Posted: Jun 3rd 2011 7:43PM (Unverified) said

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why do i keep getting unverified?

Posted: Jun 3rd 2011 11:33PM Utakata said

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@(Unverified)

Have you assigned a user name to yourself that is not already in use?
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