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Reader Comments (26)

Posted: May 15th 2011 12:41PM Lateris said

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@ Jeff, I think you nailed it with this article.

We are starting to see the AoC Wiki get updated as the community is now starting to get involved.

Posted: May 15th 2011 12:58PM Jef Reahard said

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@Lateris

Yeah I saw Ardwulf's post last week, great stuff.
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Posted: May 19th 2011 10:51AM AoCPlayer said

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@Jef Reahard

Jef, this was a solid article but you did leave out 2 major items.

1. Back in December of 2010, Craig Morrison removed the ability to PVP with friends in removing the premade mini game option. That simple idiotic move (no other way to put it) drove away almost the entire remaining PVP playerbase.

Taking your best 6 against your rivals best 6 (premade minis) was one of the greatest and only pieces of sustainable PVP content in AoC. The move was called temporary but we are now close to 6 months and there is no mini game que.

Also its not like sieges have worked since update 1.05 (Craig broke them also) so how does a PVP oriented guild distinguish themselves from other PVP oriented guilds?


2. Update 1.05 that went live around May of 2009 placed numerous and very powerful guards all over Khesheta city and all the other "good" PVP locations.

Kheshetta city was a wonderful place to PVP at and a lot of players loved to PVP there. Now there are so many guards throughout the PVP servers (FFA PVP servers at that) that open world PVP is pretty much non existent.

What was so baffling is that the PVE servers didnt allow any PVP outside of the border kingdoms and mini games so what was the push to place so many guards (Guards that 1 shot any player trying to PVP in their vicinity and there were guards everywhere) in the PVP servers? Shouldn't the players who wanted to PVE in piece play on a PVE server and allow the players who want to fight everywhere to continue what they have been doing since the game launched?

I think so and so do tens of thousands of canceled PVP subscriptions that left this game after update 1.05 came out.

The ironic thing is that during update 1.04, the PVP servers had by far the greater population of players but now they are ghost towns so how did that PVE push for the PVP servers work out for Craig Morrison.

Then if you look at some of the proposed ideas of the new Blood and Glory server, they are basically undoing everything that Craig Morrison and his incompetence have done to destroy the PVP in AoC.

He will be removing:

1. Bori
2. Guards
3 Offline leveling


Three things that never should of been allowed on a PVP server and basically all that he has added to PVP since taking over as game director 2+ years ago.

And lastly, did you folks notice that FUNCOM has postponed their annual shareholders meeting until June? It was due to take place this week but its this writers thinking that AoC's revenue (FUCNOM's only source of revenue for the most part) took a major hit in the 1st quarter and they wanted to show some changes within AoC (mainly B&G server that was due in May but wont be here until July IMO) that will alleviate the continued loss in revenue.

Remember, FUNCOM hired a new dev team and they are spending a lot more money on AoC but they have actually lost more players since hiring the new dev team than they have gained.

The 1st quarter financial report is due next week and that should be a good read.
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Posted: May 15th 2011 1:06PM Darkmoone said

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AoC was promoted as a PvP game, but ultimately failed when most of us realized the broken unfinished end game. Lack of BG's made the FFA PvP stale after awhile.

So they when all PvPer's left all they had to cater to was the casual PvEr's. The End

Posted: May 15th 2011 1:47PM Dunraven said

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@Darkmoone Yes but the casual PVE player is potentially a gigantic market. I listened to a very good speech by Raph Koster last yera and he spoke about how so many dying MMO's were missing a prime opportunity for making a load of coin by just tweaking content for the casual PVE crowd.

The group he was consulting for did a study and apparently there is some 12.4 Billion dollars a year in untapped revenue from players who try MMOs but quit because they are too hardcore...honestly if your game is dying you would have to be a complete idiot to trun away throngs of casual players begging to shove money in the pants of developers who decide not to make their game drag your face across broken glass hard.

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Posted: May 15th 2011 1:49PM Dunraven said

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@Dunraven sorry was typing to fast the correct dollar amount 2.4 Bil not 12.4 :D
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Posted: May 15th 2011 1:09PM Seffrid said

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Why would PvP'ers who have open world PvP on PvP servers complain about a lack of PvP-enabled zones on the PvE servers?

Surely the game is designed to be PvP-focused on the PvP servers and PvE-focused on the PvE servers, and that is how it should be from the developer's point of view. Whether the balance of demand between the server types favours PvP or PvE and whether the actual focus on the PvP servers is PvP or PvE is down to the players.

Where you really nailed it in my view Jef is in your reference to the lack of crafting and non-combat activities, and I hope that Funcom have time to address those issues long before they make time to add more PvP content.

Posted: May 15th 2011 7:39PM PhelimReagh said

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@Seffrid I think it's because the "hard-core" PvPers liked to twink out characters on the starter island of Tortage, and spend all day ganking new arrivals to AoC in the instanced Underhalls and White Sand Isle (where lots of starter quests were). When FunCom took that away from the "hard-core" PvPers, there was a hew and cry that new players learning the game should stop crying and take the non-stop ganking/ corpse camping like men.

In the end it was better for FunCom's bottom line and sub numbers, but bad for the "hard-core" PvPers who were then forced to PvP in the non-starter areas against more seasoned players or, as was usually more likely, find a new game where corpse camping was easier.
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Posted: May 15th 2011 1:27PM Titan1 said

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Did they ever get the siege thing worked out?

It's to bad this game and WAR took the "map" and instance approach to PvP / RvR.

All they needed to do was make one big non-instanced world map and cut everyone loose in it.

Posted: May 15th 2011 1:41PM Nyan said

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@Titan1 AoC's graphics can't work in a non-instanced world. They're already pushing the limits of hardware as it is. Most non-instanced games look awful when it comes to texture resolution and model detail. I personally wouldn't give away AoC's visual quality just to avoid a few loading screens.

Plus, I never really understood that complaint from people. The areas are so enormous that you don't even feel it's an instanced map. There's practically no performance loss if you have the max viewing distance set, which means you can see from one end of the map to the other. Only explanation I can come up with is that they didn't venture further than Tortage, where everything is pretty much split into small level-restricted areas to prevent griefing.
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Posted: May 15th 2011 3:14PM Titan1 said

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@Nyan
Did they sort out the sieges or not?
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Posted: May 15th 2011 1:30PM Interitus said

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I've never really considered it a pvp game. EVE, Planetside, Global Agenda even WAR are pvp games. The focus is on pvp, they might have pve thrown in but it's an afterthought.

Having pvp zones or pvp servers means nothing. Almost all MMO's have both of those. I'm not going to call CoX a pvp game just because it lets me fight villains in certain zones. AoC is a pve game that has the same pvp mechanics as most other pve games.

Posted: May 15th 2011 2:54PM xyna031 said

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PVP game lol?
Wut?
hmmm...

Posted: May 15th 2011 4:00PM (Unverified) said

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its not a pvp game, its the best pve game tho ;)

Posted: May 15th 2011 5:23PM mysecretid said

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Played AoC for a long time . Loved it. Still love it, and plan to go back.

Never PvPed once, and it didn't make a damn bit of difference to the fun I was having.

Is AoC a PvP game? I'd say not specifically -- but it /does/ seem to be a game where the devs realize that there are two major types of game player, and attempt to act accordingly -- as this article shows.

Posted: May 15th 2011 5:44PM (Unverified) said

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"pvp was an afterthought" - this is a bit wrong. The key to AOC is that while it is one of the most epic games in existence with massive potential, the PVE is amazing and super fun as well - BUT, the main pvp stage of AOC is set in the open-world or in two specific pvp-centric zones called the borderlands.

The main problem with AOC, as a multitude of aoc players already know is : the playerbase.

Or more specifically, the fact that there are NO GMS on the servers to police the channels and players there, and they rely on "volunteers" to take care of it mostly.

The problem with this is at least HALF of these volunteer players ARE the players that are causing the problems, or are friends with them.

Just like WAR and CO, a large percentage of the games players are the worlds biggest pieces of TRASH. Its like thousands of the most bitter, jaded, ignorant, biased and spoiled brats from around the world have joined AOC just to abuse the games systems and cause havoc.

Now they might only be the "vocal minority" on some servers, but things need to change in aoc and other mmos with the same problems.

Devs need to realize that by getting rid of the 100-200 WORST players of this sort, on EVERY server - while taking away 1000-2000 subscription payments each month, will also allow 10000x more players to return and/or try the game and not have to deal with the trash.

This is the new problem with mmos. You will see over the next 2-5 years that games will large populations will be SHUT DOWN because their players are literally DESTROYING these games!

Devs need to grow a pair and start PERMA-BANNING all players that whine and cry on forums/channels, that harass others, abuse game systems and generally rant and rave about being "bored"

No game is boring, its the player that is in fact playing the wrong game.

Also, we need REAL promotion to the 500+ million computer owners out there that dont even know mmos exist!!!! And those that do, dont even know the names of any of the mmos out there except for 1-2.

EVERY mmo could easily have a million subs or more, but the devs continue to promote to the same pool or jaded and spoiled players, which in turn, brings in burnt out and bitter players chasing whatever is new and shiny that month and then crying and quitting.

We need new players so the communities can be re-filled with players who actually enjoy and APPRECIATE these mmos.

Think about it for a second. 15/mo is NOTHING for what u get from that game. As long as you play 7-15 hours a month, you are getting your monies worth. Id say as long as you play 5 hrs, since $3 an hour to play a massive and amazing game is spectacular.

Devs need to realize all of this or you will see mmos die from the sheer amount of trash players.

Remember, 1/4 mmo players only play mmos to abuse their games and rush through the content, not even enjoying it but playing just so they can be anonymous while they take advantage of the game and its players. And about 1/10 players pay for subs JUST so they can rant and rave on channels and forums while remaining anonymous/

We need to get fresh faces into our mmos or we'll be stuck with populations full of the worst sort, forever.

Posted: May 15th 2011 7:41PM (Unverified) said

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@(Unverified)

The "tl,dr" version: "I'm the guy who kisses ass to devs ingame and on the forums and everyone else should also."
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Posted: May 15th 2011 7:36PM (Unverified) said

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Craig Morrison has explicitly said time and time again AoC has NEVER been PvP focused. Doesn't matter what the ads said or Gaute the Moronic said, that's what the current Game director has said. So take it how you want.

Posted: May 18th 2011 12:14AM (Unverified) said

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@(Unverified)

The current director has said a lot of crap. Doesn't mean they mean any of it.

He ALSO ignored the 600+ PvP RP server thread.

In fact, that final disappointment after all his big talk about things being different was the direct cause of my finally quitting in disgust.
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Posted: May 18th 2011 12:15AM (Unverified) said

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@(Unverified)
That was "PvE RP server thread."

Its late and Im tired.

And beyond disgusted with AoC management.
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