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Reader Comments (22)

Posted: Mar 24th 2011 12:21PM Daemodand said

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Uh, oh. People are going to think the rocket pack in the picture is a costume piece again!

As for the Incarnate abilities, I would have preferred them to make you into the Paragon of your Archetype, and be more closely linked to various Origins. The "everyone is Magic and homogeneous now" is a bit disconcerting, but I'm willing to work with it, if only by turning a blind eye towards the crazier elements.

Posted: Mar 24th 2011 3:55PM The Ogre said

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@Daemodand

As I've said many times on the official forums, your Origin is just that: your Origin. There is no reason why it must justify every power you ever get in your character's lifetime.

If Batman (Natural) can use robot armies and power armor (Technology), as he has in many stories that take place 20+ years in the future, or become immortal through the Magic/Science blend of R'as a-Ghul's Lazarus Pit (Generations), then your Natural Hero can suddenly learn to Fly because of all the magical energy he's been bombarded with because of Circle of Thorns attacks, or because he's been mutated and grew wings thanks to all of the biotoxins he's been exposed to while fighting the Devouring Earth (Science). [just to use an obvious and frequently-cited complaint]
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Posted: Mar 24th 2011 8:19PM patman23 said

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@Daemodand

I should have commented to your initial post then to your reply. I see now what you were thinking about, but I don't know if I would want to make my Tank extra tankie.

I like that he'll be getting some ranged damage powers.

If they had had a tremendous amount of time and funding, they might have had a system that allowed for magical incarnates, super science transbeings, and super gadgeteers to try and cover the different origin bases. Maybe one day they'll be able to retrofit (I wouldn't hold my breath, but its worth a discussion.)
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Posted: Mar 24th 2011 8:54PM CitizenH said

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@The Ogre

People worry too much about the Well.

Barry Allen was hit by lightning and splashed with chemicals and that's how he became the Flash. That's his 'origin' and by CoH definitions, it would be Science.

But the Flash's, and all unnatural speedsters', speed comes from and is powered by the Speed Force, a quasi-mystical construct. That doesn't make him a magical hero. He would never identify himself as such.

Like the Flash, being connected to the Well doesn't change your origin. You still obtained that connection through sheer will (Natural), scientific accident or inquiry(Science), technological genius or intuitiveness (Technology) or purely mystical(Magic) means.
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Posted: Mar 24th 2011 12:57PM Stormwalker said

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Incarnate power isn't magic, though it can seem that way. I'm not sure how to label it exactly. Cosmic power, perhaps? The essence of pure will given form? The Well of the Furies is the source of all superpowers in the CoH universe, including magic.

Posted: Mar 24th 2011 6:38PM (Unverified) said

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@Stormwalker You can call it Cosmic Power if you want, it's still Magic by any other name.
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Posted: Mar 24th 2011 7:30PM patman23 said

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@(Unverified) Science!

Okay, I'll agree that to present an in-game Lore reason for Incarnate stuff, it's magic, super magic etc.

For some of my characters, I'm okay with that, and for some, I have my own in-character reason for why they are TEH AWESUM and ignore the literal game mechanics.

If they had some other explanation: here's a green power ring, or surprise! Jor-el's AI has hit you with a Zeta Beam, then it would be just as limiting as Well of Furies.

If the system was abstract so you could invent your own thing, then it would seem less COH overall, and you can treat the system as abstract either way.

YMMV
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Posted: Mar 24th 2011 8:47PM The Ogre said

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@patman23

Using the Well of Furies isn't as limiting as you might think, especially if you keep my previous point (that your Origin is just your origin and doesn't have to reflect how you gain powers later on, especially outside of your Primary and Secondary sets) in mind.

Also, in the lore the Well is the ultimate source of all of the powers (of whatever Origin classification - from that super soldier serum that doesn't work right for anyone else, to Natural badassery, it's all from the Well. (though that might actually have changed now since the Well no longer seems to be the underground spring that Pandora's Box was soaking in - the opening of the Box every couple of hundred years being the cause of widespread superpowerism, the most recent of which started with Statesman and Recluse opening it)
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Posted: Mar 24th 2011 9:33PM Stormwalker said

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@(Unverified) No, it's really not.
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Posted: Mar 24th 2011 2:13PM GMax said

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Just reading the descriptions I'm starting to plan out how some of my 50's will be totally kicking butt in the near future. SWEET!!!

Posted: Mar 24th 2011 2:41PM j1083 said

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You know, this + inherent fitness + watching Young Justice really makes me consider giving CoX another whirl.

Have they done anything to address needing to be level 12+ before you have a decent attack chain?

Posted: Mar 24th 2011 3:00PM J Brad Hicks said

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@j1083 Depends on your build. But they did do something specifically to address that for tankers and defenders: defenders get a scaling damage buff that goes down with team size, so that when solo, they do closer to corrupter level damage, and the first tanker attack gives a nice single-target damage resistance debuff, which really improves solo tanker damage a lot.

But I will admit that few damage-dealing powersets get their full single-target attack chain before 18, and some of them not before level 28. It's not that they don't have anything to do before then, and it's not that they can't defeat anything before then, it's just around level 18 or level 28 that the builds really click into place. On the gripping hand, though, inherent Stamina moved all the way up to level 2 means that having an AoE-heavy attack chain from the mid single digits through the mid teens is not the massive endurance drain that it used to be, so that 3rd and heaviest single-target attack isn't as important as it once was.
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Posted: Mar 24th 2011 5:29PM (Unverified) said

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@j1083 The new inherent fitness pool also allows you to add three powers pre-L20 that were being taken up by swift, heal and stamina, so more attacks. Leveling seems a lot faster these days, too. Find a sewer team and levels fly by.
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Posted: Mar 24th 2011 5:38PM AT3374 said

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Ran the new trials last night on beta . Very cool and can't wait for this to go live .

Posted: Mar 24th 2011 7:22PM Ravenschild said

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Until they increase level cap I wont be back other than once per 160 days to keep my toon names

Posted: Mar 24th 2011 7:33PM patman23 said

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@Ravenschild Level cap? I've already got some of my guys to level 51.
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Posted: Mar 24th 2011 9:16PM NJM1564 said

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@Daemodand Quoting the developer/NPC's signature "You're bud in the incarnate powered armor." Indicating that the power from the well is generally just another power source. No different than the super glowie crystals and super techno babble generators you see in a lot of anime.



@Ravenschild The developers have already mentioned that they will NEVER raise the level cap.
Though with the higher tiers of some of the new incarnate powers will apply a level shift this is not the product of conventional leveling nor do they function like conventional levels.
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Posted: Mar 24th 2011 9:36PM Stormwalker said

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@Ravenschild The game is seven years old and they have never raised the level cap and never will. Don't hold your breath.

That said, the Incarnate system is the next best thing. Once you get the Alpha slot to rare tier, you are combat level 51 (in terms of conning and damage), and once I20 goes live and you get some of the new Incarnate slots going, you can effectively be combat level 53 (in the trials only).
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Posted: Mar 25th 2011 3:58PM starka1 said

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@Ravenschild

Wait, what? 160 days to keep your name? When did Paragon Studios reinstate a finite time limit to keep character names? I thought they had done away with that. I'm not sure when I will be back but I can assure you if I come back after 160 days and some of my character names are 'generic' that will be the last month I subscribe to the game ever. Considering 5+ years I put into the game and am now taking an extended break, I would be very upset to lose character names for a 6 month break.
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Posted: Mar 25th 2011 5:11PM Ravenschild said

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@Stark1: They stated it awhile ago...I dont know if they follow through but they stated awhile back that they can after 180 days.

@Stormwalker:IM not holding my breath...but 50 is too low...there are plenty of missions left after hitting 50. They could kick it to 60 and still have no issues (Atleast for CoV...CoH side I dont bother with)

@Patman: With incarnets youre granted the 51st level. What if you dont wanna be a god? After all the well of the furies is supposedly magical/natrual ...It isnt based off science nor an increased tech base unless its so alien we cant figure out that it is technical. To insist you do it just this way is their mistake in my opinion. and the only way I have to explkain that to them is stating my opinion and stopping payment. Of course most of my guild has as well,but thats besides the point.

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