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Reader Comments (25)

Posted: Mar 15th 2011 12:42AM Skyydragonn said

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Leave it to gamers to find ways to support people through thier hobby :)

Now if only CCP could stop the ingame grief :p

Posted: Mar 15th 2011 1:01AM kgptzac said

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This is something significant especially to those who are already paying their game time with PLEXs. The way I look at this is: I am playing the game for fun, and at the same time, the byproduct of the act of playing the game (more specifically, the act of gathering isk in game) resulted in humanitarian aid to the charity. I am glad that CCP to foster such system.

And I guess I'd do a bit more L4 missions this month for the extra PLEX.

Posted: Mar 15th 2011 2:06AM SgtBaker1234556 said

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Makes a nice press-release if nothing else. Not entirely sure if the Japanese economy actually needs any of our ISK and there's a slight possibility it might be better spent on some civil-war ridden African country, but hey, color me over cynical.

Posted: Mar 15th 2011 2:28AM Suplyndmnd said

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@SgtBaker1234556

Please do not take this personally but wtf. There are gaming companies standing up and trying to donate money. Eve Online is just one of many and every single time i hear people like yourself bitching about "oh, makes a nice press-release if nothing else". The fuck do these companies need to do to make you happy? You know, they could do absolutely shit because for all intents and purposes, they're just a company. The fact that they do ANYTHING should be applauded and who cares if it's for the "nice press-release" or for any publicity. I'm willing to hear about how a company is seeking good publicity by donating money to those in need. It's a great thing what they're doing and i'm just so tired of people like yourself who are shitting on their attempts to do something.

I guess there is no way to take it but personally but man, i'm just so tired of people on this website fucking crying over "oh they're just doing it for publicity". The second you step up and donate thousands upon millions of dollars then you can get some publicity. Otherwise, just stfu and play your games.
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Posted: Mar 15th 2011 2:38AM kiaria said

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@SgtBaker1234556 as stated in the article, the full monetary value is being donated. *dons development studies hat* Also donations to poor African countries frequently get intercepted by corrupt politicians on behalf of militias and guerilla forces, if it even gets that far. Probably more often than not it doesn't leave the pockets of the elite. It's foreign aid and finance, and the resulting debts, that have caused the problems in sub-Saharan Africa. Cynicism is fine but you should closely study the issue at hand before deciding where to direct your cynicism :)
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Posted: Mar 15th 2011 2:15PM SgtBaker1234556 said

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@kiaria

Jeez, you people are so easily trolled :-P
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Posted: Mar 15th 2011 2:48AM DLemke said

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“There are gaming companies standing up and trying to donate money. Eve Online is just one of many…”

CCP is doing a nice thing, making it easier for players to donate money, but CCP never mentioned donating anything themselves. The PLAYERS, not the company are donating the money. CCP is just reaping the benefits of looking good facilitating the process. Players could just as easily donate directly to the Red Cross for Japan.

In this case, the benefits CCP gets from the good press, far, far, far outweigh the minimal costs they incur running one of these charity events.

If CCP wanted to ‘stand up’, they’d match player donations.

If CCP wanted to stand up, they’d take credit card and paypal donations also, but CCP doesn’t because this event is about making the PLEX system, essentially a gold farming scheme. look ‘clean’, ‘wholesome’, ‘good’, when it still boils down to a gold farming scheme.

Recap…. CCP didn’t say they would be donating anything, and they are focused on their precious PLEX scam, not interested in taking donations through credit and paypal also.

Beyond that…addressing what’s wrong with PLEXs as a gold farming scam is another can of worms we can open if you really want to.

Player donations good, yes, but CCP’s benefits far exceed their costs in these projects.

Posted: Mar 15th 2011 3:17AM Brendan Drain said

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@DLemke Players can't just as easily donate to the Red Cross directly. The difference between this scheme and players donating directly is that this scheme allows players to donate in-game ISK. There are plenty of EVE players out there who would donate cash to charity if they had it spare. If CCP running this scheme allows those players to donate to charity by selling a few ships in-game or running some missions, I'd say it's a very worthwhile endeavour.

You can donate to this through credit cards and paypal if you really want, by buying a game time code through a licensed retailer and then redeeming it for PLEX. But there's no reason to do that since if you're just going to donate cash you can donate it directly to the Red Cross. This scheme is about letting people who can't afford to donate cash use in-game assets to help people in the real world. If CCP's getting good press out of it, they deserve it. They've come up with a way for us to spend pretend spaceship money to help rebuild buildings and lives destroyed by natural disasters. I don't think anyone could honestly say that isn't a great idea.

It should also be noted that CCP hasn't ever attempted to claim credit donations made by the EVE playerbase. They don't even file the donation in their own names, even though doing so would mitigate the tax costs they incurr in running the scheme. Donations are always made in the name of the EVE community, and CCP has always been quick to highlight the results as an achievement of the EVE community and not themselves. The devblog linked in the post, for example, mentions that recorded organised charity donations from EVE players total almost $100,000 US Dollars, with over $63,000 of that being donated through past PLEX For Good campaigns.
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Posted: Mar 15th 2011 4:19AM Skyydragonn said

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@DLemke
Honestly if you think that CCPs PLEX system is a scam I would wager a weeks salary that you couldn't muster enough ISK to fund your account and somehow thats CCP's fualt.

The system works great and I honestly wish MORE MMOs would incorporate systems like PLEX, it would go a long ways towards allieviated the most common issue among MMO players. payign for multiple games at a time :p

As for the relief donations....Its what I refer to as funneling. Instead of having two thousand individual donations to process the red cross gets one large donation to process care of the Eve Online community as a singular entity. CCP is encouranging players to both use thier PLEX system and donate to charity and help a fellow human being. How this is somehow a "Scam" system as you seem to think I've no idea. Even my employing corporation does things like this.
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Posted: Mar 15th 2011 4:51AM kgptzac said

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@DLemke

I normally wouldn't say this on massively... but i guess i'll make an exception this time.

are you mad, bro?
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Posted: Mar 15th 2011 5:37AM Addfwyn said

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I've never liked Eve the game, but as somebody living in Japan right now, I do take my hat off and sincerely thank CCP from the bottom of my heart for their efforts to help the relief effort. Sure, it's really the players donating, not CCP, but they are faciltiating these donations and making it easier for players who maybe otherwise wouldn't be able to help out to do a little bit to chip in, and that means a lot.

Posted: Mar 15th 2011 6:56AM KaiserZeppelin said

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@Skyydragonn

Why on earth would you want them to stop the grief? Tears are what fuels the EVE universe.

Posted: Mar 15th 2011 12:14PM Icemasta said

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It's really nice of the player to donate that way if they can't donate with cash IRL, but for CCP, it's a really nice and easy way of getting tax reduction for donations without spending a dime on their part.

Don't get me wrong, I encourage everyone to donate for whatever cause they believe and if they're broke IRL but can spend the ISK in-game, then it's really generous of the players.

In Iceland, 37.5% to 50% of the donated amount(depending on revenue and tax bracket) can be declared to reduce the tax amount. So let's say that players are able to give out 1000 plexes, or 15k worth of cash and that CCP donates the player's cash, in the end, CCP gets between 5625$ to 7500$ in tax reduction at the end of the fiscal year.

Posted: Mar 15th 2011 2:14PM Brendan Drain said

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@Icemasta That couldn't be further from the truth. As I mentioned earlier, CCP does NOT get a tax reduction for donations or claim any credit for these donations. They could potentially donate in their own name and claim it as a tax reduction, but they don't. Instead, every donation is made in the name of the EVE community.

This was actually an issue brought up by the CSM, who said CCP was wasting money by not issuing donations in their own name and claiming them as a tax reduction. CCP's response made it pretty clear that they did not want to take any credit for the good work of the EVE community. They also mentioned that could be a costly and convoluted process to even apply for the tax reduction. Details are in the CSM minutes here under the "Permanent CCP-Administered Charity" heading: http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=836

I'm genuinely shocked that people are trying so hard to think of ways that this could be some kind of corporate money-making scam on the back of a serious natural disaster. As if there isn't enough tradgedy in these events already, I'd hate to think that misinformation about tax or squabbles over PR would keep people from donating to aid relief. The only agenda CCP appears to have here is an aim to help people donate pretend internet spaceship money to charity.
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Posted: Mar 15th 2011 9:38PM Icemasta said

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@Brendan
My initial text clearly thanked the players for their efforts and mentioned the very viable alternative of donating themselves and if they are short on cash, to simply donate with ISK.

Now, I apologize about my information that was apparently false because CCP doesn't donate in their name, but such information was not jumping in front of my eyes and I was merely enumerating the possibly.

Why did I bother mentioning this? Because I've seen hundreds of corporations pull this sort of things for various donations where the people donate and the companies doesn't give a damn, I wanted to put the emphasis on the generosity of the players, especially with the lack of confirmation that CCP will donate itself.
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Posted: Mar 15th 2011 2:16PM DLemke said

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Players using pretend game money to donate real money to charity. No.

That’s part of the PLEX scam. It’s an illusion to pretend you’re creating something from nothing.

The value of that game money is tied to gold farming labor costs in the game. If gold in Eve (isk) was super easy to come by for everyone, then EVERYONE would want to pay for game time with that gold. Obviously that doesn’t happen. CCP can’t pay their employees and contractors with isk. Someone has to pay real money so… one player is labor (gold farming), while another player is buying his way through the game (buys the gold (isk)).

Where CCP makes out like bandits, and nobody in Eve feels like acknowledging the obvious, is…

A PLEX costs you 17.50/month.

A non-PLEX subscription in Eve and almost all other games costs 15/month or less depending on your plan.

Rounded, that’s a 17% mark up from the usual 15/month fee.

Anything and everything that CCP can do to make PLEXs look good, anything that makes players comfortable buying more PLEXs rather than non-PLEX subscriptions, wins CCP a HUGE markup in subscription prices. That’s why CCP loves PLEXs and promotes them all the time.

(To those CCP apologists who say that Eve on the other hand doesn’t charge for box fees and expansions… hold on, if you wanna open up that can of worms, sure, that’s true, but I’ll point out that CCP tips the scale way in the other direction by

Making a sandbox game, not an amusement park game. Their production costs are much lower for it, deliberately. I can site you an article in which CCP says ‘content’ which they do not do much of, but rather rely on players mostly for their ‘content’, is the “most expensive” aspect of development.

Also… Eve is full of players with multiple subscriptions. CCP might not charge you for a box or expansion, but the CCP’s game mechanics, and the Eve culture really pushes multiple subscriptions hard. You just aren’t very leet unless you have more than one sub.)

So anyway, don’t tell me Eve is ‘cheap’, or ‘inexpensive’, because it’s not.

Whether you pay in labor (gold farming) or real money, you pay. PLEXs, which raise subscription prices, are central to CCP’s business model.

Charity is great. The end result here is a plus, no argument there. I like babies and kittens and puppies and rainbows like everyone else here.

Don’t pretend CCP isn’t benefiting though.

Posted: Mar 15th 2011 2:30PM kgptzac said

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"Why does CCP not donate by themselves?"

Seriously. I think such mentality has grown far beyond in the social regard of human generosity. Why would you expect others to donate, and why would you feel angry, offended, or anything of the sort when you your peer or some entity did not donate to a common cause? Do you think because you have donated, so you have the rights to pressure others into donating as well?

People have reasons to donate or not to donate, and as an individual I hell don't need anyone to tell me to either "donate, or be looked up on like a cold-hearted bastard"

Posted: Mar 15th 2011 2:42PM kgptzac said

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Your explanation of the PLEX system is fairly straightforward and is common knowledge. Can you elaborate on which part of that is a "scam"? If not, I suggest you tuck away your personal vendetta as a anti-microtransaction fanatic.

Posted: Mar 15th 2011 2:43PM kgptzac said

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@kgptzac

was meant to reply to DLemke's post
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Posted: Mar 15th 2011 3:13PM Xilmar said

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haters gonna hate... well, except for SgtBaker1234556, who, might as well make it official, is the primary troll when it comes to anything eve related.

anyway, what CCP does is they provide a way for the players to donate ISK (in game currency) by buying PLEXes, and then CCP forwards 100% of the RL value of the donations to the Red Cross.

Hats off to them for doing this again. If you think about it, it's one - if not the - most important and meaningful gamers -> RL interactions. I could go on to point several ways in which this closely resembles the mentality of many groups in our society - like a church group, university society, and so on - and how extraordinary it is to see it in an almost 9 years old game, but those that can understand the idea already know it.

Anyways, i'll be doing my bit, donating some of the fairly little i have. Would have more => donated more, but a combination of war decs from several alliances and fairly annoying high sec war mechanics had a toll on my wallet.

But if you have some ISK to spare, and want to, give the little you can to the Red Cross. It's human nature to help those who need it. If we didn't have this ability, humanity would have died out a long time ago.

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