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Reader Comments (16)

Posted: Mar 10th 2011 3:08PM Nautius said

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If you lose sleep over a raid wipe, then you need to quit MMO's.

Seriously.

Decent write up though.

Posted: Mar 11th 2011 9:04AM Malagarr said

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@Nautius

That was my first thought when I read the "Don't Panic" part at the start (well, besides admiring the sheer genius of anyone who quotes DNA). But the rest of the article is actually pretty good advice that new raid leaders should definitely pay attention to, imho. =)
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Posted: Mar 10th 2011 3:26PM DevilSei said

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We wiped you say? What do we do you ask?
I'll show and tell you what we do (which conveniently falls in line with that last bit).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBZNS2WRpyM

Posted: Mar 10th 2011 3:55PM RogerRoger said

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LoL, had to laugh when I saw the pic of everyone taking a dirt nap. I've seen that waaaayy to many times.

Posted: Mar 10th 2011 4:16PM (Unverified) said

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As a raid leader one of the most frustrating things for me is wiping and having 3 or 4 people coming to me to change the strategy when the strategy was fine. It's important to recognize when a wipe is a problem of execution and not of strategy.

Posted: Mar 10th 2011 4:28PM DevilSei said

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@(Unverified)

If the strategy is "right", sometimes it can be as simple as the strategy not being right for the team.

Back when I still raided (and played) WoW, we were doing the Saurfang fight. We had two holy paladins, and more than enough enough battle-rezes to bring them back, to ignore two marks, and not worry about a 3rd then.

What happened was we were getting hurt bad by that 3rd still, whether it was because buffs were forgotten, I don't know. All it took was a slight shift and having the 3rd pally (dps) use his cooldown before the two holy ones and get brought back up through a B-rez, and it fixed the problem. It even allowed us to down the boss before he ever got remotely close to popping a 3rd.
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Posted: Mar 10th 2011 4:21PM Space Cobra said

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What you say in your naysayers section and then about being well-grounded (or even humble) is, IMO, pretty much true of many situations in life, politics, and other things.

It is easy to criticize/complain but hard to praise, generally speaking.

Posted: Mar 10th 2011 4:24PM Ryukan said

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Firstly the title of this articl should end in a question mark hehe.

Secondly...now what? Well, suck it up, admit you suck and try again.

Because seriously, if your raid had it down to one percent and the raid wiped when the tanks died and couldn't finish that ONE WHOLE PERCENT, then maybe it was just suckness.

Or maybe just a sucky run.

Posted: Mar 11th 2011 9:00AM Malagarr said

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@Ryukan

I'm guessing you never played EQ. In WoW, and a lot of newer MMOs in general, gimicks make encounters tough. If you get a mob to 1%, yes, even if the tanks die you'll probably manage to burn it down. But in EQ, where mob difficulty was increased simply by giving it a gazillion hit points, losing your tanks, even at 1%, almost always meant a wipe. I suspect the author is harkening back to the days of yore with the "1%" tid bit.
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Posted: Mar 10th 2011 4:24PM Lateris said

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"I know Kung FU"

"I AM AN FBI AGENT"

Posted: Mar 10th 2011 4:39PM Apakal said

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Point fingers.

If you're seriously pushing progression, a wipe is often going to be the result of one person's mistake. I've seen guilds slam their heads against a wall over and over again because one person kept doing something stupid and no one had the backbone to call him on it. This doesn't mean you need to be a dick about it, but chances are the person who made that mistake doesn't realize it, and won't realize it until someone points it out.

Even if you aren't pushing progression, you should still let people know directly what they did wrong. Everyone wants to a better player. Reducing mistakes by recognizing them is one of the ways to get better.

Posted: Mar 10th 2011 5:16PM KDolo said

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"Don't Reinforce Defeat" is an interesting heading. Your anecdote suggests a heading more to the tune, "Dump players who aren't performing."

Posted: Mar 11th 2011 9:15AM Malagarr said

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"Pointing fingers" may be a bit of an overstatement. You don't want to call out the person who messed up infront of the whole raid. Not only will you upset them, you'll hurt the morale of your raid force in general and turn people against you as a raid leader.

The proper way to handle it is to send the person a tell explaining to them where they slipped up. Be understanding (they messed up because they honestly didn't know any better...not because they're an f-up). But at the same time, be firm, especially if they choose to argue with you rather than accept your advice.

Oh, and if you aren't the raid leader? Don't send any tells to anyone regarding their performance unless (a) the raid leader asks you to, or (b) the player is asking for your input. We've all raided with those people who think they know all their is to know about an encounter and take it upon themselves to set everyone else straight. Trust me when I say no one likes those people.

Not implying anything here. I suspect when you said "point fingers" you already had all of this in mind. But having led raids for, wow, has it really been a decade now? Anyhow, having led raids for a long time, I've seen how much harm can be done by someone who has no business getting involved.

As a raider, your first rule of thumb needs to be this: trust your raid leader. If you don't trust them? Find another raid. Don't question their authority, and don't question their strats unless they ask for your advice.

Now I'm rambling. =)

Posted: Mar 11th 2011 9:18AM Malagarr said

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@Malagarr

This was meant as a reply to Apakal, above. Seems like the reply button is a bit borked this morning. =)
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Posted: Mar 11th 2011 12:34PM Ryukan said

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Actually I have played EQ, back in the day and newer MMO's (expect WoW). I have seen some wipes in my time but never been involved in a 1% wipe. But hey I guess it happens.

I guess its not too terribly sucky of a raid to get the boss to 1%, but to wipe at 1%...well that sucks hehe.

Posted: Mar 11th 2011 4:39PM Dethdlr said

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Nice article.

Something that always irritated the heck out of me is something that others have touched on a bit above. Strat changes/discussions during a raid.

Here's the scenario: We're fighting a mob that we take down every time we try. Sometimes it takes 2 pulls and on a rare occasion it takes 3. Today, we were short a few people and end up taking a friend from another raiding guild or a pug to fill the slot we needed filled. We wipe on the first pull. Our guest decides to offer their guild's strat on how to take down the mob. As asked above, as the raid leader: what do you do?

If you answered "spend the next 15 minutes going over a new strat with the guest", IMO, wrong answer. It might be different if it's a mob you've tried before but never managed to take down. But if it's one you take down regularly with the strat your raid force came up with, politely tell them that you appreciate the offer and would like to chat with them after the raid, but the strat we are using works good for us, we just had an unlucky pull. Give it another pull or two and the mob will be dead just like it has been the other 50 times you've killed it using this exact strat.

It's fine to adjust a strat. For some, it's fine to discuss strats with other raid leaders/raid members ourside your raid force to find something that works better than what you're doing now. But if it's for a mob you already know how to kill one way, PLEASE, talk about it before or after the raid, not during. You end up with 22 other people twiddling their thumbs and scratching their heads trying to figure out why we aren't just killing the darned thing the same way we did the last 50 times.

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