| Mail |
You might also like: WoW Insider, Joystiq, and more

Reader Comments (15)

Posted: Feb 2nd 2011 2:25PM Katsiya Vell said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
A few notes on Tankers.

First off, you WILL be crying out for Endurance almost no matter what you do before 22 and the ability to buy Single-Origin Enhancements at the very least. The common Invention enhancements could possibly fix this, but aside from a team with high damage and/or Recovery buffs out the wazoo (like 2 to 4 Kinetic Corruptors, Defenders, or Controllers), you'll have trouble just keeping going.

This is mostly due to how many toggles you may have with the defensive sets IN ADDITION to the low damage out put that Tankers have all around. They have a low base damage, and while they can put out some very good numbers, it will still take quite a while to get the attacks and the enhancements needed to -reach- those numbers.

Secondly, you can be damn near invincible as a Tanker, provided you're smart about it. Learn early and quickly what holes your Defense set has and what you could do to fix them. Also realize that there may not be a way for you to completely cover every possible base, especially when it comes to Resistances and Defenses. There are just too many to cover, and too little ways to do so any ways.

Finally, like with any of the ATs, just remember to be patient. Things can be rough early going, but in the end, they can get better. But do remember that you are there to have fun, and if you aren't having fun or think you're going to have fun with that combo, then don't be afraid to take what you can that'd be useful and get rid of the character. Never spend time on something you don't find fun.

Posted: Feb 2nd 2011 3:14PM Heraclea said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
One caveat about Willpower: it requires a bit of a different approach to aggro control than most of the other sets have.

All of the other sets have an aura, a PBAoE toggle which applies a taunt effect to affected mobs. For most sets other than Willpower, this is enough to hold each affected mob's attention. For some sets (e.g. Invulnerability) this effect hits automatically; for others (e.g. Fire) it does not. The auras also have debuffs that they put on mobs or buffs for having enemies within the aura. Ice tankers have two auras available to them. Generally, for most tankers, the aura is all the control they will need against mobs in its range that are not giant monsters or archvillains, which tend to resist its taunt effect.

Willpower also has an aura, but it is weaker than the others, with less than a tenth of its duration. You may as well pretend it isn't there. This means that willpower tankers are meant to hold aggro with their attacks instead of an aura. You need to constantly attack to hold aggro. You are designed to be able to do that; playing the set gives you a second Stamina type power that's better than the standard, so endurance should not be an issue and you should easily have more sustainable attack chains than other sets do. The more multitarget or AoE powers you have (Fire and Electric melee sets stand out here; Super Strength, Mace, Axe, Ice, and Stone aren't bad) the easier time you will have.

None of these factors affect Taunt, the power included in every tanker attack set, which works the same regardless of your defense set.

Posted: Feb 2nd 2011 3:14PM Brianna Royce said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
I love tanking, but I was never able to get into tankers at all until last year when one finally clicked with me: a dark/icy. Since the icy melee overhaul, icy actually packs a decent aoe punch (for tankers);, it just blooms kinda late in the damage department and can never really top something like fiery. Dark is really fun, like a health bar seesaw as you smack your enormous heal and sit in your many clouds of toggles and buffs. But it has a lot of the same ups and downs of a really group-centric controller, maybe an earth/ta -- it solos too slowly for words and really needs a group.

Posted: Feb 2nd 2011 3:16PM Peerless Girl said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
Despite the fact you are mostly factually correct in your explanation of Tankers (though not perhaps in your opinions--though you're entitled to them) you got the effect of Gauntlet (Tankers' inherent passive power) completely backwards.

Gauntlet doesn't as you stated: "Their passive ability is even geared specifically toward tanking; all incoming damage provides them extra threat and inspires enemies to target them first."

What actually happens is all OUTGOING damage (more precisely landed hits) provides more threat (and radiates in an AOE effect from the hit target to affect other nearby targets as well) than normal, and helps a tanker get and maintain aggro. It's commonly referred to as "Punch-voke". Brutes also have a version of this ability, but unlike Tankers, theirs is not AOE, and only affects the targets they actually hit. (The two are roughly analogous to passive versions of standard Tanker Taunt (in the case of Tankers) and Confront (the single target taunt) in the case of Brutes.

As for endurance issues, I never actually had any except back in the "old days" (Pre ED) at levels before DOs, and primarily due to the massively high cost of fly. Once I learned ED and slotted all attacks for end reduction (attacks are actually more important than toggles to slot early on, as they represent more end burn than the comparitively low burn toggles, even though the toggles happen more often). Toggles, while often cited as the main end burn for Tankers really aren't, if said tankers attack at all. I've found that a majority of CoH ATs (especially Tankers but not ONLY Tankers) suffer from Endurance issues purely because they don't slot correctly or enough for Endurance Reduction.

Posted: Feb 2nd 2011 6:20PM Eliot Lefebvre said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
@Peerless Girl You are correct, that typo has since been fixed. Sorry about that!
Reply

Posted: Feb 2nd 2011 3:47PM El Furioso said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
My namesake and first-ever hero, created back in 2004, is an Inv/SS, and it's been my favorite archetype ever since. If you like the feeling of being immune to your puny enemies' attacks, this is the way to go, especially if you can spend the time and Influence to soft-cap both Resistance (90%) and Defense (45%).

I've always felt my favorite times as a Tanker, other than KO Blowing enemies into low-altitude orbit, are when a teammate will rush right up to an enemy that I'm engaged with, attack them.. and the enemy completely ignores them and continues to attempt to beat on me. That's quality tanking.

Posted: Feb 2nd 2011 4:41PM CitizenH said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
"Today's archetype is a perfect example, one that covers Superman, Colossus, Giant-Man, Captain Marvel"

I disagree vehemently about identifying those characters as Tankers in CoH.

Each of those characters evoke a certain offensive might Tankers lack.

Colossus is more akin to a Brute.

Superman and Marvel exemplify a character archetype the game simply doesn't support, the "Paragon", in MMO terms, a tankmage. If I was to force either to fit into CoH's system, in theory they'd be Super Strength Incarnate Scrappers built for survivability with expensive IO builds.

Giant Man really doesn't fall into CoH's system either. True, he makes a big aggro target, but he can do massive per hit damage, albeit slowly, and he's only moderately tough.

People tend to associate Tankers with Supes, including the devs who made their 'expy' hero Statesman a Tanker, simply because the AT was the only one to originally have super strength. IMO this is a bad thing to do and only sets people up for disappointment when the fists start flying and their "super strength" is overshadowed by some guy with a sword or kung fu.

Posted: Feb 2nd 2011 4:58PM Stormwalker said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
@CitizenH Superman is indeed a tanker. Admittedly, the melee damage is on the low side, but Superman can otherwise be easily made in CoH. Take some Flight, the laser beam eyes power from an Ancillary Power Pool, and Supes is the iconic Invulnerability/Super Strength Tanker.

The only Marvel hero I'd call a Brute is the Hulk, as the Fury meter is clearly inspired by his "Madder Hulk gets, stronger Hulk gets!"
Reply

Posted: Feb 2nd 2011 6:27PM Eliot Lefebvre said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
@CitizenH Well, we can argue technicalities all day. You can make a case that Wolverine is the tank half the time, albeit one with more regeneration than anything.

As Stormwalker points out, you really can model Superman (and most of Marvel) with the Tanker options. True, he's far more offensive in his own comic, but most Justice League shindigs focus on him in a more tank-esque role simply so he doesn't solve every problem himself in a matter of moments.

Colossus, though... Colossus is strong, but he's humanly strong. Piotr's a very large man, and while he's a bit past the human limit thanks to his body makeup, he still gets thrown around by the super-strong contingent repeatedly. (Juggernaut has lost strength contests to a lot of people, including M if memory serves, but he could still toss Colossus around pretty easily.) That's what's always been so awesome about him, that he's big and strong and nigh-indestructible, but never actually as big or as strong as the people he's fighting.

Giant-Man... well, I'll give you Mr. Pym, but the whole size-changing powerset isn't really modeled very well. (The Avengers don't have any particularly reliable tanks. Maybe that's why they keep screwing up most tasks of major importance.)
Reply

Posted: Feb 2nd 2011 10:53PM Jeromai said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
Tankers are one of the archetypes that can set the pace of the team, with comparatively little risk to themselves. Brutes and scrappers can take an alpha but their health bar ricochets around a lot more. Tankers tend to be more steady. It's just fun to be an unbreakable pillar, and the moment you run into a spawn of mobs, as long as your aggro toggle is on, booom all of them refocus and centre their attention on you. That influence, control, power is heady. And you get to punch them too.

And they're a good archetype to practice the art of mob movement and positioning on, since a mistake doesn't lay you flat immediately. From herding, corner-stacking, pulls using bits of scenery so small you'd think you were still in LOS...

You can go as fast as you like (alpha to alpha as the team cleans up behind you) or as slow as you like (gather up a bunch of mobs solo, oops, someone knocked at the door, walk away without a worry while mudpots or fiery aura slowly whittles them down into nothing. Come back and chortle before upping the pace to actually hitting them when you're playing.)

To me, tanker defenses don't really mature until you hit the level range where you can slot SOs or their IO equivalents. Until that point, you're just a slightly sturdier, and a lot less damaging scrapper/tank hybrid.

Posted: Feb 3rd 2011 4:48PM Peerless Girl said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
*snerk* Enjoy CO while it lasts, DCUO will likely destroy it. Might take a year or so though, since DCUO's off to such a slow start. On the other hand, DCUO isn't really a threat to CoH, totally different gameplay mechanics...and lack of customization. CO however sits right in the middle between the two, and faces competition from both. Of course the whole ballgame of MMOs changes in September...

Posted: Feb 4th 2011 1:21AM Valdamar said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
@Peerless Girl
Can you name the last MMO that specifically killed another MMO? I'm struggling to think of one.

Most MMOs seem to get killed either by their own Dev team's ineptness, a terrible launch they never recover from, or they just fade away from natural attrition.

Even WoW didn't put any fantasy MMOs out of business in that first year when it had such spectacular growth.
Reply

Posted: Feb 4th 2011 7:05AM Cam L Tow said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
@Peerless Girl

*snerk* " since DCUO's off to such a slow start"

Ummm last I heard DCUO has over 400k subscribers. That is 4x what CoX currently has and matches the highest ever confirmed number in the game.
Reply

Posted: Feb 4th 2011 1:17AM Valdamar said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
Tanker and Defender are the only non-epic archetypes I haven't levelled to L50 in 5 years of playing CoH - my love for Brutes and Corruptors just overshadows them in every way (just like I don't have an L50 Peacebringer cos my PB just seems weak compared to my Warshade) - plus CoH teams rarely need a dedicated Tanker or supporting Defender when other archetypes can fill their roles 95% pf the time.

I was making an effort to get a Tanker and Defender to L50 but both stalled at L20 despite using powersets I'd already enjoyed playing to the level cap on other characters (Shield/Super-Strength Tanker and Dark/Sonic Defender respectively). I think I need to make an Ice/Ice Tanker so at least the Tanker's powersets are something new I haven't played before - that might work as an impetus for levelling him.

Posted: Feb 4th 2011 9:20PM Peerless Girl said

  • 2 hearts
  • Report
Maybe counting the PS3 AND PC numbers together, but DCUO is primarily a PS3 game, and that's great and all, but those of us who were in the beta could tell you quite a bit about how big a mess it was.

Featured Stories

Engadget

Engadget

Joystiq

Joystiq

WoW Insider

WoW

TUAW

TUAW