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Reader Comments (28)

Posted: Jan 30th 2011 8:44PM paterah said

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I just started downloading this a little while before this was upped. I don't feel like paying a sub for a superhero MMO tho, but I have to say DCUO looks pretty good, just hope I had a key these days to try it out. I hope CO will keep me for a while.

Posted: Jan 30th 2011 9:07PM Caerus said

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@paterah If you like CO, at all, I strongly suggest you lay out the 5 or 10 dollars for a digital copy and the included 1 month of subscription (Gold). The difference in both actual gameplay and personal attachment when it comes to being able to pick your own powers and the full range of available travel powers is phenomenal. Not only that, but Cryptic is frankly one of the worst offenders in the overcharging-in-the-cash-shop department, and a subscription ameliorates a great deal of the headache associated with that.

I'm still on the fence if this game is worth a 10$/month sub (almost definitely not worth the full priced 15 for me), but for a month of gameplay it's worth the money.

I loathe Cryptic, but CO has come a long way in the past year or however long it's been out, and while it falls a little flat as a full-fledged MMO it's great for jumping in for a short playsession, or for solo players who like a chat room.
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Posted: Jan 30th 2011 9:10PM Caerus said

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@Caerus "I'm still on the fence if this game is worth a 10$/month sub (almost definitely not worth the full priced 15 for me), but for a month of gameplay it's worth the money."

This doesn't make a whole lot of sense now that I look at it; what I'm trying to say is the game is going to be a blast for a month or two, but you might find yourself having burned through all the content in that time and a long-term full-priced sub wouldn't then be worth it.
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Posted: Jan 30th 2011 11:08PM ShivanSwordsman said

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@Caerus

Technically, it's not worth a sub price at all, at least with the way they're trying to get you to do it. Taking away a core mechanic of the game leaves you unwanted by raid groups, gimped in usefulness, and worst of all, unable to really invest in your character. There's no option to just pay for the Freeform and be done with it, you have no bank, you only get 1 backpack slot, several pieces of the basic clothing are sealed off behind a pay window, and if you haven't played for 20 hours, you can't talk in Zone chat or use the mail system.

Ultimately, I see no reason to buy into this game or really support it. It feels more like an expanded, overglorified trial. Even worse is the fact that 2 archetypes have to be bought. It's not expansion content at all like LOTRO's Warden and Runekeeper. This is basic content, but you have to buy it. I don't know who they're trying to fool, but this is just as terrible as Sony demanding subs to get certain levels of gear and skill levels. This is NOT free to play. It's just another shallow, overglorified trial.

I had fun with the game, I'll admit that, but there's no incentive to buy into their cash shop for something. It's either sub or screw off. Turbine had the system that rewarded you for buying points with adding extra character slots free, and server connection wait time lowered, as well as being able to put stuff up on the Auction House, and trade money (which keeps gold sellers out). I'd rather just buy a $30-$40 boxed game and have it forever, like Guild Wars.

Also, the end game looks terrible. DCUO is definitely looking to be the big cheese, and we'd all be very, very lucky if it went free-to-play. Of course, with Sony heading it, and seeing what they did with Everquest 2, it would probably be absolutely terrible. Sigh. Just can't win.
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Posted: Jan 30th 2011 11:52PM GaaaaaH said

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@ShivanSwordsman
To rub it in more, C-Store purchases are now character specific
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Posted: Jan 31st 2011 3:59AM pcgneurotic said

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@GaaaaaH

Most of the items and all of the services are account-wide.
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Posted: Jan 31st 2011 4:00AM pcgneurotic said

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@pcgneurotic

...not only that, items from the C Store can/will be gifted, traded and auctioned in-game.
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Posted: Jan 31st 2011 4:27AM Protoavis said

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@pcgneurotic

I don't think costumes are account wide anymore
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Posted: Jan 31st 2011 6:29AM pcgneurotic said

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@Protoavis

I just double-checked, and the good news is that costume sets, archetypes, powers and travel forms are all account-wide. I guess they learned from STO's initial per-character mistake there. :D
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Posted: Jan 30th 2011 10:10PM wagonfactor said

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after hitting max lvl in dcuo, i can safely say champions is way more fun and has waaaaaay more content. and champions isnt broken, doesnt have a poor ui, doesnt have a terrible chat system, etc, etc. dcuo has beautiful graphics but i really really like the cel shaded look of champions.

Posted: Jan 31st 2011 12:46AM Super Nerd said

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@wagonfactor I haven't played DCUO so I don't know how much content they have, but Champions has so little end-game content it's painful.
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Posted: Jan 30th 2011 10:25PM Protoavis said

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The more I play the FtP the more I'm realising the model isn't likely to hold up to a paying FtP customer (ie the people Cryptic want since the whole move to FtP was about the lack of $$$ meaning the game has a viewable death on the horizon). I say this because even if you buy EVERYTHING in the cash shop your toon isn't going to hold up to a subscriber who has better power sets (and can custom colour them if that's your thing), if you were a paying FtP would you bother sinking money into the game if your toon was going to be subpar? Would you pay to be gimped? Not even the other hybrid sub/f2p models do that, you can buy your way to as an effective toon as a subber can, that just doesn't seem right so it being offered here because THEY (Cryptic/Atari) need our $$$ to keep the game going, to keep their jobs, seems really short sighted. FtPers aren't going to start subbing in the numbers required, it's not what they do, the cash shop doesn't give any option to make a toon on par with a subber so what's the point is going to be the attitude on a large part of the people with the $$$ that Cryptic are trying to get.

Posted: Jan 31st 2011 4:12AM pcgneurotic said

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@Protoavis

Saying things like "FtPers aren't going to start subbing in the numbers required, it's not what they do" is really not a helpful, productive or intelligent thing to say. Reinforcing this insane 'us and them', or should IU say 'us VS them' atttitude is spurious and counter-productive.

I pay monthly subs to a number of games, and I also spend money in various games' item shops too. So what does that make me?

In Champs' case, I paid for a box ages ago I used to subscribe too. Since Free For All, I've converted all my characters to Silver status and bought 2,000 points which I straight away spent on character slots, the two adventure packs and the Specialist archetype. And guess what, that suits me fine, my characters are great, and the fact I don't have a free-form character does not make me 'gimped'.

The central problem is that a huge divide has grown around Champs' free-from character builds. It seems that most hardcore players are only in the game for the free-form builds and anyone else playing - whether back then or now - who *isn't*, is somehow wrong, stupid, worthless, uncompetitive or gimped. Which is, when you think about, such an utterly bone-headed concept that it literally takes the breath away.
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Posted: Jan 31st 2011 4:42AM Protoavis said

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@pcgneurotic

"Saying things like "FtPers aren't going to start subbing in the numbers required, it's not what they do" is really not a helpful, productive or intelligent thing to say."

It's called honest. By default a paying FtP has avoided subscribing they aren't likely to start subbing because they prefer doing it by micro transactions. It's a customer that isn't going to be pulled into a sub but they will and do pay micro transactions for the same service...this is something the model glosses over entirely.

"uncompetitive or gimped"

Because they aren't, there's a very good reason that archetypes got their own separated pvp queues, they aren't competitive to a free form.
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Posted: Jan 31st 2011 6:34AM pcgneurotic said

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@Protoavis

The two queues thing I didn't know about, and it's certainly compelling evidence. But, I would still hesitate to call anything non-freeform 'gimped' in a PvE situation (I don't do too much PvP so I can't comment on that), because what would the point be of offering nine choices where only one was valid? Illogical, captain.
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Posted: Jan 31st 2011 1:26AM Balraw said

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Well for me personally if the F2P's intention was to get people to subscribe then for me it worked. I tried the trial of this a while ago but found that it was so limited that I couldn't really get into the game. Having been given the chance to play alot more of the game via the F2P I found it enjoyable enough that I wanted to invest some time into creating a character of my own hence why I subscribed for a few month's. How long i will play I don't know but for now I am having a blast ... literally :)

Oh one word of caution (for UK subscribers at least) the cost of the subscription shown on their website does not include VAT. So the cost you actually pay will be 20% higher than they advertise it at i.e. 1 month at £8.99 is actually £10.79 etc. I found this slightly annoying at this is not mentioned at all on the page where you choose your subscription model. A bit naughty if you ask me but I am no lawyer so don't know the ins and outs of what they need to say or not. From a customer satisfaction point of view though it sets a poor first impression of Cryptic as a company.

This may be the same for anyone in a country that has VAT or a sales tax but I can only comment on the UK as that is where I am from.

Posted: Jan 31st 2011 4:05AM pcgneurotic said

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@Balraw

99% of the time you make such purchases online - from an mmog company, or from Steam or D2D etc - the tax isn't advertised up front because the text is for global audiences, or at least is region specific. You just have to accept that your country's vat will be added at the checkout stage.

All of which is to say that it's not specifically a wrong-doing on Cryptic/Atari's part. :)
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Posted: Jan 31st 2011 4:39AM Balraw said

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@pcgneurotic Umm that's not been my experience. Take Steam for example when I make a purchase from them at the purchase and review part there is a message that says "All purchases include VAT where applicable." I have found that this is common practise for good/services regardless of where/who I purchased them from

Of all the many mmo's I have subscribed to (based all over the world) this is the first time this has happened for me. Hence why I was surprised. Its not so big a deal when subscribing monthly as the difference is less than a couple of £'s but I imagine if someone sprung for a lifetime it wouldn't be as easy to shrug off.

The thing is its an easy thing to solve all Cryptic need to do is put a single line saying something like "prices do not include VAT/Sales tax as applicable" somewhere on the payment page.

To be fair Cryptic does have this information on their website but its hidden away in an obscure part that you wouldn't see unless pointed to it (as I was) and its certainly not anywhere near the payment screen. For me its just common sense customer relations but sadly these days common sense is not so common

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Posted: Jan 31st 2011 4:44AM Protoavis said

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@pcgneurotic

Steam doesn't do the global thing on the price confirmation page, if tells you your price including anything region/country specific.
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Posted: Jan 31st 2011 10:52AM Brianna Royce said

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@Balraw This is standard practice for MMOs that do not simply absorb the extra tax or charge UK and EU players a higher sub to begin with. It is also true for those of us in the States for whom there is an additional state tax -- Blizzard, for example, charges that extra tax in certain states. You can always decline to sub once you see the total fee.
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