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Reader Comments (119)

Posted: Aug 10th 2010 9:50PM BubleFett said

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The style of the trailer is very reminiscent of Korean mmo trailers
the fast cut scenes the I got mission to finish and put an end to the evil.
Damn, I like it hurry up Arenanet. I got the 60 bucks already to give to you.

Posted: Aug 10th 2010 9:51PM (Unverified) said

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Everything that The Old Republic should be but isn't.

Posted: Aug 10th 2010 9:57PM Yoh said

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Oh I'm going to get hate mail for this one.

Ultimately I agree with most of what Anet said and shows here, and I think they are going in the right direction, and have pretty much the right idea when it comes to innovation. And I'm almost certainly going to buy it when it comes out.

However, with that said, on the issue of combat being different, they are completely full of crap.
Colin Johanson said "When you play the combat in our game, you say, wow that's incredible, I've never seen anything like that."
No, what I'll say is, "What do you take me for?".
I mean look at everything they have show of combat in their video releases, and take note of the fact that the AI is still as thick as pig shit. It runs up, and the two sides kick each others shins until one of them falls down.


Yes, they have given the player new tools and the new engine is much more capable then the first, thus allowing the player to engage in a much more freeform, tactical form of when it comes to innovation. And I'm almost certainly going to buy it when it comes out.

However, with that said, on the issue of combat being different, they are completely full of crap.
Colin Johanson said "When you play the combat in our game, you say, wow that's incredible, I've never seen anything like that."
No, what I'll say is, "What do you take me for?".
I mean look at everything they have show of combat in their video releases, and take note of the fact that the AI is still as thick as pig shit. It runs up, and the two sides kick each others shins until one of them falls down.


Yes, they have given the player new tools and the new engine is much more capable then the first, thus allowing the player to engage in a much more freeform, tactical form of combat. Which should work really, really well as far as PvP goes...... as other players can actually think, and react.
But this is only part of the solution.

The other parts are AI, and targeting.
While little to nothing has been said on targeting (please correct me if I'm wrong), but it is reasonable to assume that they will use tab targeting, or some variation there of.
Or in other words, get in range, press tab to target, then press 12345fcking6 until your target is dead..... then move onto the next speed bump.

And with the AI being so evidently mindless (while I would concede that EOTN, and thus GW2 has some of the best AI I've seen in an MMO, but that's not saying much), how can one expect the entire experience of combat to be even remotely different?

And I'm not saying that you therefore need actual intelligent AI to fix the situation, as that is not possible, but I do think you can at least make the AI 'faint' intelligence, as I have seen it done, where it acts in a manner in which you must watch and listen as to figure out what it's about to do next and react, rather then just rush in and wail on everything.
I'm not going to get into that here, but check out the Monster Hunter series in regards to really, really good AI...... as nothing else I have ever seen comes even close.



At the end of the day I think their heart is in the right place.
Colin Johanson again saying, "..we want to change the way people view combat.", Great, fantastic...... then why don't you actually change f**king combat. And a good place to start, is overhauling conventional AI and targeting.
You've taken a step in the right direction, but your not there yet..... just a few more steps.

As to these statements about how they've already made combat distinctly different, it is just completely disingenuous on their part.
I don't buy it for a second...... please prove me wrong.

~Yoh

Posted: Aug 10th 2010 11:09PM Tanek said

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I am not saying you are wrong, but have we actually seen enough combat to make any of these calls yet? They have already said that the short clips are a) sped up for effect and b) high level players against much lower level mobs, so I'm not sure it is really indicative of true combat we'll be experiencing as we play.
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Posted: Aug 11th 2010 1:55AM Yoh said

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Ya'know tanek, that's a fair point.

It's something that was running through my head as I was writing this.
And maybe I'm wrong on this one, and I would be so glad if I were.

It's that from what we have seen of the AI thus far, is that it is pretty much the same as it was in the first game...... dull and unimpressive.
But I would like conformation one way or the other.


However given how often these big proclamations of change turn out to be false or misleading in the MMO industry, it's something that deserves scrutiny.
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Posted: Aug 11th 2010 2:33AM Dirame said

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I can agree that we have to see the combat before we decide (I do love me some Buildwars) but when it comes to Ai you cannot say they haven't improved especially when EoTN was the beginning of GW2 basically a testing ground for things to come and have you done the War in Kryta quests? The newly released story arch, part of the GW: beyond series? Have you seen the Ai for that? Those guys are bloody unpredictable and because their builds are randomized you can't really pinpoint how they will come at you.

With all that said, there is no reason I can think of to say GW2's Ai won't be better.
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Posted: Aug 11th 2010 3:46AM Yoh said

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Well Dirame, you may be easily impressed, but I'm not.
But I guess well find out next week with the demo. That should be entertaining and informative.
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Posted: Aug 11th 2010 9:23AM (Unverified) said

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You must have missed the article that mentions them using high level characters to beat extremely low level enemies to show off the characters skills in the video.

All the videos they have released so far was to show new professions and some skills, there's no videos out yet to show off the AI, you're just assuming things way too quickly...

AI is always an ongoing task in game development, and it will only ever be completed near the end of the project cycle. In the case of MMO's they will keep at it and update the game with better AI over time.

When ArenaNet releases, look at what they are trying to show off and not all the other minor details that might e unfinished. No game company will release a perfect video of their game while they are still developing it.
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Posted: Aug 11th 2010 9:33AM (Unverified) said

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releases videos*
be unfinished*

WTB edit button :)
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Posted: Sep 10th 2010 5:13PM (Unverified) said

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Doesn't ticle my picle.

Posted: Aug 11th 2010 9:26AM Junkmaster said

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While I don't always agree or understand all of what ArenaNet does I've learned to give the changes an honest chance and 99% of the time it works out for the best. A break from the norm is a good thing. I may want ot play GW2 right now but, I'll gladly wait for them to finish it and make it right.

Posted: Aug 10th 2010 11:08PM (Unverified) said

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Let me add some corrections:

- "affect the world in a permanent way": this means that if you participate in events (= quests) successfully, then this has a lasting effect. If you and other players manage to reclaim a destroyed village upon a horde of centaurs, then that village stays conquered, the original villagers returning and slowly building the town up into a fully functional town with merchant NPC's etc. This new situation will also generate other events/quests like scouting the centaurs' base or pushing the war further onto attacking their base with other players and NPC squads.

- "non grindy": this they do by making the leveling towards L80 not one of steadily increasing length, but equal in time needed, time to level from L79 to 80 won't be that much longer than from L19 to L20.

- PvP is in World vs world vs world and in arena fights, that's all they've released in info for now.

- combat is VERY different than what's usual in MMO's: no healer class, no aggro management+meatshield tank, team combos, use of environment while attacking, this all makes it very non-standard.

- AI can't be determined from the videos: ofc the mobs were easily defeated and dumb to show off the skills.

For the rest, I've no doubt we'll learn more from the Gamescom demo's that will be next week.

Posted: Aug 10th 2010 11:21PM Saker said

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Continues to look good. Will hold off judgment till something playable. Gotta always watch out for the pr bs!

Posted: Aug 10th 2010 11:22PM Valdamar said

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I've been burnt out on fantasy MMOs for the past few years after too much time spent on both EverQuests (5ish years total including beta time), with half-year forays into MMOs like DAoC and WoW, plus having tried most other Western fantasy MMOs for shorter periods. In fact a few years ago I told all my MMO friends I would only be playing non-fantasy MMOs in future.

But GW2 has got me excited about fantasy MMOs again, bringing a dynamic world, spontaneous questing and the tactical combat I have always wanted to see in MMOs. I believe ArenaNet are bringing the innovation and the adventure back to the MMO industry and banishing the grinding and the gameplay-cloning of the last 5 years. I am now more eager to play GW2 than I am to play SW:TOR and pretty much anything else that has been announced (even the WoD and WH40K MMOs, whose lore/IPs appeal to me far more). Nuff said.

Posted: Aug 11th 2010 12:31AM (Unverified) said

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And by your own responses to my post you deign to believe that everything that Bioware announces is pure perfection without any point of reference whatsoever. It's not a hate on, but i'm not going to mindlessly adopt a dismissal of old convention because someone else says it's good.

Posted: Aug 11th 2010 12:32AM (Unverified) said

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CORRECTION: ArenaNet, not Bioware. Funny, both of them have been disgusting me as of late. Hence the correlation between the two.
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Posted: Aug 11th 2010 12:48AM (Unverified) said

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Lol. You're disgusted by both Bioware AND ArenaNet?! What's next, puppies and Doctors Without Borders?

I see, you're clearly a Cryptic or SOE fan.
/sarcasm off

Anyway, point of reference: GW.
Enough possible team setups w/o either dedicated healer or tank that you could encounter or use there.
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Posted: Aug 11th 2010 1:32AM bAss ackwards said

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Execution by electrocution.

Guild Wars 2: Electric Boom Stick 2

Posted: Aug 11th 2010 1:44AM Bhima said

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After seeing this video, I think its safe to say that the art of GW2 is the best in the genre period. Their environments aren't just good technically, it seems no matter where you look its as if you are looking through the lens of a great cinematographer. If this game is half as good as it looks, it will be a smash hit. Sign me up! Oh wait, I don't have to sign up... I just have to buy the box!

Posted: Aug 11th 2010 3:49AM spamero said

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Nothing wrong with the grind AS LONG THE COMBAT IS FUN!

Geez.. when all those game companies realize that?

When you have lots of grind and boring combat you doomed for failure (aka Aion). The funnier the combat the more grind there can be.

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