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Reader Comments (101)

Posted: Jul 1st 2010 1:26PM (Unverified) said

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@Gauge

Sorry, I meant WoW clone as in single character doing quests, killing 10 of this, FedEx quests, etc. I passed on WAR after learning they were lumping everything into two sides, so I have no idea how different WAR and WoW are, as I don't play either. I should have made that a bit clearer.
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Posted: Jul 1st 2010 12:58PM Wisdomandlore said

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The problem with making a game that plays more or less exactly like WoW is that WoW has more content. Not only did it launch with more content than most games do, it's been out for 5 years. So when players rush through all your content and run out of things to do...they're just going to go back to WoW. It has the same mechanics of your new game, but it has 10x more content. It's a pretty easy choice.

If developers want success they need to differentiate themselves from WoW, not copy it.

Posted: Jul 1st 2010 1:15PM TheJackman said

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Our simply launch with more content them WoW has! its not easy that will take a ton of man power but you will need keep hook your users... Blizzard does it the right way they teasing new content patches all the time, have people on the form dropping hints all the time of changes to come. Listen to there players (well mostly) release betas. Doing press tours and so on...
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Posted: Jul 1st 2010 1:11PM TheJackman said

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Not gonna happen but I wish them good luck, this WoW player is still recovering from the honor fest that was Warhammer Online!

Posted: Jul 1st 2010 1:27PM foofad said

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As a huge 40k fan, this makes me so sad. So very, very sad. I hope to god he's talking out of his ass on this one because any relation to WoW either in gameplay or in aesthetic is going to completely turn me off of what SHOULD be a frigging amazing game.

Seriously guys; you have the IP, just do Warhammer. Don't screw it up by making some other game, just make Warhammer.

Posted: Jul 1st 2010 1:29PM Nef said

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I always see plenty of 'WoW is too easy' comments whenever comparisons are made between MMOs, and I find it pretty funny. I remember WoW's launch and several of the MMOs before it, played nearly all of the MMOs after it. What's so challenging about any of them? It's all just mouse and keyboard clicks.

What WoW brought was a less grindy, more solo experience where you could log in and immediately get into something to do. Many MMOs before that required grouping to accomplish a lot of things, which wasn't bad, but would take more time to get to playing. Plenty of MMOs before it didn't have many quests, killing mobs was the way to go for leveling and gearing up (thus, the grouping to take on more/harder mobs to try and speed up the process). WoW had plenty of quests to complete; questing helps aid players in the leveling process by giving them short term goals to complete (this does help a lot of people, though there are plenty that hate such things). Lastly, WoW polished up quite nicely -- something that I remember very few MMOs accomplishing at the time.

So, if WH40k brings: a solo friendly environment, getting into the action quickly after logging in, marked trail for progression (not necessarily hand-guiding, but not leaving newbies dazed and confused), and polish -- how is that a bad thing? Won't live up to everyone's tastes, but it wouldn't be terrible.

The big problem with his statement is the last line, "I'm full confident we're going to get them." Being confident to a degree is fine, but one million is a bit overboard. If he was confident in being profitable and still growing at 150k, I'd be fully supportive of him. If he's looking at getting a million easy, then this must not be a PvP focused game. (Which, I think is going to ruffle some WH40k player's feathers.)

Posted: Jul 1st 2010 1:32PM spamero said

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Personal I don't care if that's a wow clone if done right. By done right I mean it's FUN.

We've seen many wow clones who failed miserably. I must say I like what I saw so far about war40k.

Obviously I'd like to see games like Chronicles of Spellborn or AoC to be at 14 mil users. They were both fun and fresh.

Posted: Jul 1st 2010 1:32PM spamero said

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s/who/which

Posted: Jul 1st 2010 1:36PM (Unverified) said

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Oh well.........so much for that one.

Posted: Jul 1st 2010 1:39PM Sunlover said

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It seems his only error was using the word, "WoW." This word will automatically send a number of people into a frenzy, regardless of what you are saying before or after...

Not once did he say that WAR40K was a WoW Clone, or anything close. He said that the game is "very friendly" to people who play WoW. And he's excited about that fact and the fact it may appeal to a portion of WoW's user base. Heaven forbid a person who helps make and publish games be excited about actually making and releasing a game and setting some goals for them! *Gasp!* Off with his head!! Seriously? Good for him, his company, his talented, hard working employees, and his game. Hopefully, he and his teams can deliver. And if not? The world will continue to revolve around the sun and there will be plenty of other games to choose from. Personally, I'm looking forward to this one, and the fact that it's "WoW player friendly" intrigues and comforts me because I am of the opinion that WoW is a polished product, if nothing else, and that many MMOs could and should learn a lot from Blizzard's overall level of quality.

I'll tell you what I am tired of, though: The trendy, doomsday is coming, generally negative and nonconstructive, WoW Clone hating or anything WoW related commenter clones all over the internet. Newsflash! WoW isn't going anywhere, and neither is its influence. Deal with it and move on please. Seriously, it's gotten really old and really pathetic. WoW/Blizzard isn't making --insert your favorite MMO game here-- worse, that game's developers are.

Posted: Jul 1st 2010 4:55PM JustPlainJim said

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Thank you thank you thank you for being one of the extremely rare people on this site that seems to think calmly and rationally and doesn't instantly grunt "WOW BAD!" at the first mention of any Blizzard product. After reading several pages of frothing-at-the-mouth anti-fanboys (and one in particular), I was starting to feel like the only person that read the "wow-friendly" part of the article and like I was the only person that plays WoW and other MMOs at the same time.

Personally, I like the idea of this being WoW-friendly. Easy to hop into. Even if it's one of the "everyone's a hero" models like WoW is (let's face it, how many MMOs out there aren't like that?), if they can make it fun and still stick to the lore, I'll be happy. I really hope they don't read through these comments looking for advice and just carry on with what they think is best. They want to release it "when it's just right", and if the Dawn of War series is any indication, they can pull off Warhammer 40k and make it "just right".

TL;DR - Thanks for not being bat-s*** crazy.
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Posted: Jul 1st 2010 5:55PM Sean D said

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Blizzard did a lot right with WoW. There's no question about that. The underlying issue, at least for me, is that copying the WoW formula results in stagnation in the MMO genre. WoW is considered to be the best, but that doesn't mean there can't or won't be better. To create an MMO with the goal that it will mimic WoW in some ways in order to steal some of its success is weak and scavenger-like. Yes, it frees the developers from having to build a game from the ground up, which has its benefits, but results in a product being unoriginal and boring. They'll probably make their money on the sale of the boxed product, but they'll lose subscribers quickly as people realize that they can find everything this new product has to offer in just about every other MMO out there, which means THQ is relying on the IP to sustain the game. We all know well how that turned out for Mythic.

And in regards to the IP sustaining the game, I was disappointed with the E3 video as it seemed to portray the 40K universe in a cartoon-like manner. I'm not just talking about the graphics, but the lack of skulls on armor, for example. I'm talking about that morally dark, gothic, bloody, and unquestioningly violent quality that is the 40K universe. It wasn't there. Granted, in cutting out the evil and violence THQ can market to a wider (read: younger) audience, but in doing so amounts to little more than developing a game that represents the 40K IP only in name. The IP won't sustain the game because the game doesn't support the IP.

Anyway, it's too early to say anything definitely. The game isn't due for release for quite a while. My only hope for the game, whatever system they use, is that it accurately represents the lore of the 40K universe.

Even if they have to put an age rating on it.
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Posted: Jul 1st 2010 1:42PM Its Utakata stupid said

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I am not sure why they can't let the game speak for itself.

Posted: Jul 1st 2010 1:57PM (Unverified) said

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The more Vigil or THQ releases about the game the more it seems they are digging their own grave. It was inevitable a 40k mmo would release and it seems THQ is still emulating Blizzard, by copying how they fleshed out the 40k universe to the public gamer.

Release of 40k IP as an RTS game, Dawn of War = Warcraft 1&2. (in the sense that it is a basic RTS with loose special character units)

Continuation of 40k IP RTS with Dawn of War 2 = Warcraft 3 (the addition of actual character units with talent trees and customizable armor)

Finally, 40k Dark Millenium MMO = World of Warcraft (unfortunately referenced as a clone by the THQ VP http://www.massively.com/2010/07/01/war40k-courts-1-million-users-wow-players/2)

This is all fine and dandy they are taking a route which has proven successful, however they are cheapening the experience for the “potential WoW to 40kDM Converts” they are hoping for by openly associating their intended success by copying WoW.

So far since their short coming out party they (Vigil and/or THQ) have added two black marks to their new MMO franchise.

#1: Openly associating how they will need success based on 1million subscriptions from WoW, catering to WoW casuals from the get go will rile up the 40k fans who they are hoping to wrangle.
#2: Their biggest sin to the IP and fans so far (Speculation) The 40kDM site, Game Info section has a portion which says “Side with the forces of Order, or the vile hosts of Destruction, in a war that will unlock ancient secrets, reveal dark purposes...” This indicates two faction warfare which is a travesty to the IP. Unless they only release Imperium vs Forces of Chaos (unlikely since they showcased orks)

Number one isn't as bad since it seems, after reading the interview itself over the Massively.com spin version. Mostly because the VP mentions he plays WoW and just comments how he would change over, and then relates it to the 14million gamers claiming that 1million would make them a great success.

To be continued (limited by amount of URL insertion)

Posted: Jul 1st 2010 2:50PM OmegaDestroyer said

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So basically THQ is copying Blizzard who copied Games Workshop?
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Posted: Jul 1st 2010 1:57PM (Unverified) said

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Number two however sounds very familiar to a certain failure I have etched into my memory (Warhammer online anyone?) This is of course another assumption but a scary one based on their own words “Side with the forces of Order or Destruction”. If this is something you want to change you can do 1-3 things (retrieved from warhammer40konline .net):

1)Be so kind and drop Vigil Games a line on their facebook page.
http://www.facebook....23006&topic=128

2) Sign the petition (your name will not show if you sign the petition):
http://www.petitiono...M/petition.html

3) Join the facebook group "We don't want a two-faction-system in WH40k Dark Millenium"
http://www.facebook....122334907808242

I could not agree more with the 40k mmo fans, the game should have more than 2 factions minimum or one for each race, and should be similar in design to a third or first person view of Dawn of War 2 with a hero you create and his squad to balance the game and create true scale of battle (10v10, would look like 30v30 even restricted to 3man squads), do not base the game solely around PVP like WAR when subscriptions slow or fall the content of world pvp disappears and subsequently so do more of your player base. Anything else I missed can be summed up as, stay true to the 40k IP, its successful all these years for a reason. Deviation from the IP will spell failure for a game which many people with disposable incomes are holding their breath on.

THQ/VIGIL remember there is no wrath greater than that of a pissed off 40k fanboy!

Posted: Jul 1st 2010 1:57PM (Unverified) said

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THQ/VIGIL remember there is no wrath greater than that of a pissed off 40k fanboy!
I leave you with two comic strips relevant to this
penny-arcade.com/comic/2006/4/10/
penny-arcade.com/comic/2007/3/5/

Posted: Jul 1st 2010 1:57PM Thojorkill said

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Looks like another loser folks. I had high hopes for this one as well...

The second I heard "we're going to give WoW a run for its money" from senior staff on this project my stomach sank. I talked to these folks at E3 as well, and it seems they believe that you can degenerate a mmo to pigeonhole casuals with wow type mechanics, and you will suddenly have a license to print money.

That statement is always the development deathnail...

So bummed... WTF. Why can't they make a hardcore 40k game? Warhammer fans are some of the most hardcore sob's on the planet, from tabletop to their spending habits, and WHO died because of its WoWish form, and look where they are now. The rabid warhammer fanbase evaporated from that game, guilds left, and it was all over. It had nothing to do with wow subs bailing. It had to do with a shoddy RvR system (which wow trumps) and shoddy raid endgame (which wow trumps) when players got to these areas in the game, they bailed, plain and simple.

If I want some instant grat I'll go play WoW dumbasses, not something that WANTS to be, or PRETENDS to be WoW.

Posted: Jul 1st 2010 2:52PM (Unverified) said

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Agree with your comment Thojorkill.

I believe the best course to success with a new MMO these days is to simply not talk about it. Show quick clips of cool things (gameplay) and shut up. Leak miniscule bits here and there, and when you are closer to release dump a bunch of greatness on players. I consider Guild Wars 2 to be quite successful with its marketing so far. They were totally quiet for 2-3 years, and now we see things, perhaps even great things.

I have not run across any conversation where Arena Net folks were like "yeah, and it's gonna have blusterbuss and bullets, and cows, and, and it's gonna be very familiar to the core WoW player, and we have graphics and customization and and, WoW players will be pleased, and if we can just get a % of them we will be great!" (/reachforholsteraimatfootpulltrigger)
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Posted: Jul 1st 2010 2:07PM (Unverified) said

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Make the first four faction RvR game, dudes. Trust me, it'll work out.

And then, when the dust settles, add a fifth faction. You'll go down in history.

-SirNiko

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