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Reader Comments (17)

Posted: Jun 22nd 2010 1:49PM Superfan said

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Well, I am glad we have a date set.

Sadly, I am told that the expansion will offer very few new mission maps/tile sets. I am so sick of seeing the same old maps. If Going Rogue does not offer new mission maps and mission styles, I will be leaving CoH for sure. I have already stopped my sub until GR (again). It is really tough to see the same old crap over and over. You would think, after 6 years, we would have much more variety in mission maps.

Posted: Jun 24th 2010 1:29PM Valdamar said

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> "Sadly, I am told that the expansion will offer very few new mission maps/tile sets. I am so sick of seeing the same old maps."

Where did you see that? Official source?

If it's just a community rumour then I'd counter it with the fact that on my server most people seem to be expecting lots of new tilesets/maps and mission types with GR - especially considering the multiple choice option technology the Devs now have for mission dialogues - plus the fact the Devs said every single piece of art in Praetoria is completely new - and that in Praetoria instance maps for missions are supposedly always entered through the same building door and that the interior map would match the exterior dimensions/style of the building (so no more entering a cave doorway and finding yourself inside a bank, or entering a tiny tenement block and finding yourself inside a huge sprawling warehouse).

We definitely need lots more variety in tilesets and mission types though, considering that 95% of the gameplay is inside instances.
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Posted: Jun 22nd 2010 1:54PM Haggs said

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Whoo-hoo! I'm excited that Going Rogue is coming out soon!

I can't wait to explore Praetoria and play with all the new, fun stuff that'll be in this expansion.

This is a great time to be playing this awesome game! City of Heroes just gets better and better!

Posted: Jun 22nd 2010 2:41PM (Unverified) said

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This message brought to you by the NCSoft PR department and the City of Heroes development team.
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Posted: Jun 22nd 2010 4:16PM Haggs said

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It's not a crime to really like CoH and be excited for where the game is going.

Don't agree with me? That's perfectly fine. I personally didn't agree with Superfan's 2nd paragraph, but he's entitled to his opinion just as I am.
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Posted: Jun 24th 2010 1:31PM Valdamar said

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@Haggs - Yeah it will be great to have some new outdoor zones to explore. I've been playing CoH since I5 and despite having a few new zones added with issues we've not had so much new territory to explore since CoV's launch (which came with I6, when all of CoH was still new to me anyway).
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Posted: Jun 22nd 2010 2:05PM bjooks said

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Woo-hoo! Finally, a date! When the changed the date from "July" to "Summer," it was obvious they were expecting it to go a bit longer. I'm glad to hear they'll only miss the July date by just over two weeks. Is there anything coming with GR that we don't know about yet?

@Superfan: In the Bigdownload interview last week, War Witch said there would be new map tilesets, and hundreds of new missions. And honestly, I don't mind the old tilesets so bad so long as they do different things with them -- move spawn points, etc. The new doppelganger missions in I17 were a great example of old-ish tilesets playing differently thanks to better designed missions.

Posted: Jun 22nd 2010 2:41PM bjooks said

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And to answer my own question -- they announced today that they'll merge the auctions and black markets with GR. Now THAT's sweet.
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Posted: Jun 22nd 2010 2:55PM aurickle said

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Also, if I remember correctly she specified that these new mission types and tile sets will only be in Praetoria. So you get new content for the first 20 levels of the game, but then it's back to the same old, same old for the next 30 levels.
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Posted: Jun 22nd 2010 6:19PM Sam not Spam said

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Well, keep in mind they're going to have to at least rework content for the morality system; you can't switch sides if you never get to make choices. Chances are there'll be new content to go along with that. I'm not saying everything will be overhauled, but 20-50 should have some improvement there too.

We also know the devs said that i18 is GR with i19 basically finishing off stuff they couldn't get to for GR's launch (much like launch/i2, COV/i7).
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Posted: Jun 23rd 2010 4:21PM (Unverified) said

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Yes, War Witch said "hundreds of new missions."

I'd be thrilled if this actually meant hundreds of missions composed by skilled writers, but I have to consider she's counting auto-generated "tips" missions.

If there really are hundreds of new missions that aren't "tips" missions, I'll get the expansion.
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Posted: Jun 24th 2010 1:33PM Valdamar said

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The market merge is great news as well - that's something the game has needed for a long time.
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Posted: Jun 22nd 2010 8:47PM (Unverified) said

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All I've seen them say is that there will be enough content to take players from 1-20, and presumably that's 2 tracks (one good, one evil).

There will also be a random mission generator (tips) much like the newspaper and police scanner missions.

And 4 small zones, if I remember correctly.

So this is not a large expansion like CoV. Just a small one.

Posted: Jun 22nd 2010 9:03PM Sam not Spam said

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Well, COV was a stand-alone game. Think they called it an "expanshalone" at the time. It also cost full price ($50) at launch. Going Rogue is an actual expansion, hence it having less content and a lower price tag (you can pre-buy it from NCSoft for $30).

Don't forget: the Incarnate System is tied up with Going Rogue.

Also; hopefully the devs won't have the tracks that clearly defined (good and evil), especially with them talking so much about Going Rogue being very "gray."
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Posted: Jun 23rd 2010 1:15PM (Unverified) said

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Well, the "grayness" of GR is largely in the NPCs and in your imagination, as I understand it. Your character decides whether to be a rebel or loyalist, and that sends them to blue or red sides.

I believe there is one arc to turn your toon blue, and one arc to turn your toon red. That's because players bringing their existing toons to Praetoria to switch sides will only want to play about 1 arc to switch each toon.

Aside from that, we've been told there will be content adequate to raise a toon from level 1-20. That's not much these days, especially when you consider there's also a "tip" contact for randomly generated missions. So I expect a maximum of 4 arcs, plus the two side-changing arcs. So that's one arc per zone, plus "tips" missions in each zone to unlock the contact.

The "grayness" of Praetoria will probably show up in the native arcs as variable responses to your contacts. So you'll click "I'll save your kitten, ma'am!" if you're aiming for the blue side, or "If you pay me, I'll save your damn kitten! GRR!" if you're aiming for red side, and everything else is more or less the same.

Eventually, when you get to a high enough level, you'll be able to choose a contact that opens the gateway to the blue side or the contact that opens the gateway to the red side.

If you come to Praetoria from red or blue side with an existing character, your side-switching contact will already be unlocked. ("Desdemona / Maelstrom needs your help in Praetoria!")

So I estimate there's about 6 new arcs, a small number of new maps (which are likely goatee versions of sewers, etc., plus some instanced areas of Praetorian zones), no new ATs, the two already-released power sets, 4 small zones, a plethora of new badges, the already-released graphical update (Ultra Mode), probably about 2 booster packs worth of costume items, about a half dozen goatee Paragon enemy groups (DE, Ghouls, Syndicate, Destroyers, etc.), and the first step of the Incarnate System, if it gets done in time. Probably there will also be a Praetorian version of a Monster Island / Hami raid, though I could see where that would come in a future issue.

You'll have to buy GR in order to make use of the Incarnate System, which seems to me to be contrary to what was publicly said half a year ago by the devs. However, the Incarnate System won't be coming with GR, but will appear in a later issue.

CoV was, as you say, a MUCH larger release, with new ATs, new power sets, new zones, dozens of new arcs, new enemy groups, a full set of new costume items, etc. It was a game you could play for a few months or a year before exhausting it, as opposed to GR which will have novelty for a couple of weeks.

I hope when GR comes out the devs will decide to give players unlimited AE mission slots, as players who make missions have probably already filled all their slots, and now here comes this whole Praetorian theme to explore and they have no empty slots to use.

Posted: Jun 24th 2010 12:46PM (Unverified) said

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You have to admit that's a whole lot of assumption going on there though. That tip missions are randomly generated, that it's only one arc for each side to switch sides, that there's only one story arc for each of the four zones added in to Praetoria. Heck, I don't even think that four story arcs would comfortably take everyone from 1-20.

I would expect a safer assumption would be somewhere around the same amount of mission content included in the CoH or CoV release for the 1-20 level range (possibly more since I think there's supposed to be content for both loyalists and resistance characters, not just one singular story progression). It mostly comes down to my not being able to imagine that even marketing would try to spin 30 new missions (roughly 6 arcs worth of missions generally) and some randomly generated missions (which I still don't think has been stated as being random or scripted, it's all just assumption at this point) as 'hundreds' of missions.

I mean the expansion's clearly not going to have as much to offer as CoV did unfortunately, but I also very much doubt it's going to be as bleak as you're painting it to be.

Oh, and you forgot the two powersets they didn't already put on the live servers for prepurchasers. Electric Control and Kinetic Melee.
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Posted: Jun 24th 2010 2:30PM (Unverified) said

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I've found the dev's comments about GR to be confusing. For the longest time they've been saying there will be enough content to get from 1-20 - which suggests low content - and then in this latest interview they say there will be "hundreds" of new missions. So the question for me is: how many of these new missions will be authored content, and how many are auto-generated "tips" missions? (And yes, it's an assumption that "tips" missions are auto-generated, but ... c'mon now. That's a very reasonable assumption.)

My low ball guesstimate on the number of arcs is based on the majority of the dev's history. Since 2005, if you discount CoV, they've released 5 arcs a year. If they break that pattern, great, 'cause I think 5 arcs a year sucks mightily, and I would not buy GR for 5-6 arcs.

It has occurred to me that if there ARE just 6 arcs, it would explain why the Incarnate System has been tied to GR, in that they needed to give players more of a reason to buy the thing.

If there are truly "hundreds" of new authored missions, that would suggest to me a likely minimum of 20 contacts (100 / 5 = 20). That would be pretty nice, and clearly right up there with CoV, as it offers five contacts per zone. I've sent the devs an email asking them to clarify this situation, though, because 20 contacts does not square with "from 1-20."

BTW, I believe players could level from 1-20 on just 6 arcs, so long as they must run 3 "tips" missions to unlock each new contact. In CoH, imagine doing Azuria, scanners for jetpack, Wincott, Flux, scanners for zero-g, Julius, scanners for self-rez, and Talshak. That would get you to 20, no problem, and that's 5 contacts plus 3 sets of auto-generated missions.

As for what you see as my negativity ... really, it's just based on what the devs have done throughout their history. There's been very little new content - except for CoV - and they doggedly oppose a revamp of old CoH content even though most players believe the game would benefit from it. (Players often request new content for Perez Park, Dark Astoria, etc.)

If GR is more like CoV, then I'm all for it. A big slug of new content is sorely needed.

And yeah, I realized afterward that I'd omitted Electric Control and Kinetic Melee from my list. On the other hand, they're not things I'm looking forward to, either, so it's easy for me to forget them. Sorry for the omission.

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