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Reader Comments (10)

Posted: Jun 21st 2010 8:23AM Meagen said

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EvE is a bad example of "low stakes". The entire game is based around making your virtual stuff have real worth through the amount of time and/or money you spend to get it.

Posted: Jun 21st 2010 9:06AM Amblin said

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Meagan every mmo is the same.

Eve is odd as it is an mmo with a pvp centric design. Most other mmo's are pve with pvp tagged on as secondary and having little or no meaning.

This makes guilds (corps) in Eve so much more complex. Power corrupts and I see a lot of power play in corps as it is seen that position = power.

I for one prefer to be king maker as opposed to king as kings die but kingmakers (facilitators) usually survive into old age and carry enough clout to set their own agendas. Eve is also different in that basically anything goes. So intrigue, sabotage, bluffs and double bluffs are common. It makes for a very exciting arena of ego's, plots and pawns.


The only thing that I dislike about guilds in MMOs is that because there is often no drive for a guild to exist or little interation witht he game and the guild (as an entity) they tend to have devolved into a friends list.
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Posted: Jun 21st 2010 9:57AM (Unverified) said

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Amblin,

That might be the most nonsensical, inane and unfounded diatribe I have ever seen, and I have written my fair share.

Nowhere do you state how guild politics in EvE is different from other MMOs, stating that there is (mostly) no reason to join a guild in other games. Moreover, your statement about the "friends list" is equally true for EvE as it is for any other game.

What is a corporation but a group of friends willing to do things together and trusted with their abilities to accomplish something? How does this differ from a guild interested in end-game raiding? Besides the fact that you're not up against other players, there is no difference. You expect people to perform and contribute.

Simply because there is less reason to join a guild for themepark games than there is for sandbox games doesn't mean that those reasons don't exist, or, to the point of the article, that politicking doesn't arise in guilds in games other than EvE. Indeed, politics can be equally as dramatic and perhaps even more pointless.

Personally, I contribute to my guild. If that warrants an officer position then so be it. If I am asked to do something I don't want to be responsible for, I step down.
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Posted: Jun 21st 2010 11:45AM Meagen said

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EvE isn't unique in allowing backstabbing, it's unique in making backstabbing be *worthwhile*. Wrestling control of a large alliance from its former leader can make you fabulously ingame wealthy, not to mention infamous forever (itself a great reward). Which is why EvE is a bad example for "low-stakes guild drama".

Now, if we heard a sordid tale of manipulation and betrayal for the control of a two-week-old corp between two people with less than 10 million ISK to their names, *that* would be "excessive drama for incredibly low stakes".
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Posted: Jun 21st 2010 12:00PM (Unverified) said

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"Moreover, your statement about the "friends list" is equally true for EvE as it is for any other game."

I don't have any opinion about the other things you said, but this is at best a half-truth. There are a lot of important gameplay mechanics related to corp membership that include aggression flagging, POS access, corporation taxes, sov, etc. so I think it is probably pretty fair to say that there are compelling gameplay reasons beyond a "friends list" to join a corp in EVE.
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Posted: Jun 21st 2010 9:15AM (Unverified) said

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I personally don't really care about leadership positions in guilds. I tend to only join guilds that are more laid back, which is similar to my play style.

Posted: Jun 21st 2010 9:18AM Darkdust said

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In general, I really enjoy planning and organizing guilds (EVE corps). I don't necessarily have to be THE MAN, but I like helping lead: organizing structures, setting up operations or events, and maintaining internal community.

Posted: Jun 21st 2010 9:54AM Stormwaltz said

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The guilds I belong to are never more than 30 or so people, so small and casual that there are no "officers" or politics.

Speaking for myself, I play games to have fun. Herding cats is not fun.

Posted: Jun 21st 2010 10:42AM Valdamar said

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In my wide and varied experience of MMOs the exact opposite is true - most people want to follow and very few want to lead because of the hassle involved - that goes for guild leadership but also team leadership. Like most people I want to play MMOs to have fun, not as a second job or to carve out some petty empire to make me feel better about real life, so I try to avoid leadership roles, but I always fail.

So I usually end up in leadership roles, even though I don't enjoy it, purely because no-one else will step up - in fact I've doomed myself in that I've led so many teams, guilds and raids in the past ten years that my friends automatically assume I'll be leading by default, because they say I'm good at it.

So yeah, I usually don't have to scheme to advance myself in guild power structures because I'm usually sat right at the top from day one, by default, but I'm happier being a smaller cog when I can get away with it (not often).

Posted: Jun 21st 2010 11:42AM (Unverified) said

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My take on this is that you have to respect the power structure that is already in place or you might be doing your group more harm than good. I think there is an axiom that says something to the effect of - better to have everyone follow one mediocre leader and his mediocre plan than to have the group trying to follow 5 different geniuses who each have their own brilliant plan.

If you feel like the group is being mismanaged better, (for me at least) to walk and go elsewhere than try to put on a coup.

That being said if the CEO and I are talking and he brings a topic up, I'm not shy about giving my opinion on it but at the same time I don't have any expectations that he'll agree or act on it.

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