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Reader Comments (76)

Posted: Jun 18th 2010 8:43PM Lethality said

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That is player armor.
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Posted: Jun 18th 2010 8:21PM (Unverified) said

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Great review, love the honestly also; as others have stated. Thanks for the heads up, like to see the hype fading into the reality of the game. It's going to be like the pc version of old republic, but an MMO. Doesn't sound bad to me at all. Just hope the moves are smooth and the launch is as well. I'll probably be going lifetime if that's available; like I did with Star Trek Online (also a good MMO). Thx again.

Posted: Jun 18th 2010 8:38PM Sharuk said

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Good to hear, you don't have to reinvent the wheel to be a success. Why break a formula that works? WoW was considered an EQ clone with quests with more casual gameplay and look how successful it is.

If SWTOR is as casual as WoW it will easily be a huge success, the more casual the more subscribers it will have.

Can't wait for this game I am fed up with WoW after 4 years.

Posted: Jun 18th 2010 8:46PM (Unverified) said

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With the information we have at the moment, looks like swtor is going to be enjoyable at least for a few weeks... I'm glad, however, like others have said, I'm waiting too for the next step in mmo's. This is more of the same with a few tweaks. We already have plenty of mmo's like this...

Read my lips, new mechanics, higher player capacity for bigger battles, more depth, and new stories.

These are bleak times in the mmo industry, even bush has more criativity than these guys.

Posted: Jun 19th 2010 3:07AM Ingrod said

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Good, companions, conversations system, mini-instances without screem loads, cover system (for much compared to rogue stealth dont is, you continue seeing where the character is), content divided in clas storylines, all of these ARE new mechanics, new to MMORPGs.

They never talked about be very innovative in combat or gear, they are innovative in others systems. They bring the Bioware system to MMOs, and that is very loable.
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Posted: Jun 19th 2010 3:14AM Ingrod said

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Also Bioware is famous for write good stories for his games, if you want new stories in MMOs the correct game for you is SWTOR,

In all Bioware games you kill things, and in these games nobody call that "farming mobs", I cant understand because the common Bioware mission interluded with conversation cutscenes translated to a MMO is suddenly transformed in farming and WoW clone lol

I dont have doubt that this game will have intersenting storylines to see.
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Posted: Jun 18th 2010 9:38PM (Unverified) said

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It's sad to see that the only acceptable form of expression is a mild and poorly justified cynicism. If anyone is enthusiastic about a product, their opinions are quickly denounced as "fanboyism." While this poorly thought out article is championed as a voice of reason.

All of the "final thoughts" presented were either irrelevantly true or embarrassingly misunderstood conclusions.

Smuggler equals rouge? Sounds like the uninspired pronouncement of someone with a gaming vocabulary of extremely limited terms. Could you honestly think of nothing else? The smuggler plays nothing like a rogue. Cover, with directional advantages and no usefulness in an open field, is nothing like stealth. As you exclaimed, it didn't stop you from getting hurt. The only basis of comparison it has, is that the action bar rolls over during both states. Hardly a substantial point. The exchange of ranged fire, the angles one must be in order to benefit from cover, and the timing of attacks with opponents' reloads all contribute to make cover feel unique. Further, cover does not make you immune to attacks. It simply reduces damage from enemies attacking within a firing arc. You puzzle at why you are still getting hit. A simple reading of the tool tip would have revealed why that is so. Damage reduction, not missing attacks entirely.

The combat being "not revolutionary" is entirely irrelevant. A game does not need to be revolutionary in order to be amazing. And in many respects (companions, story, personal spaceships, multiple person conversations) it is. Too much revolution and your target audience is lost in the experience. Maintaining some familiarity draws people in. The game play is solid. Exciting (as you eventually figured out) and has enough genuine innovation to keep things interesting.

But despite your criticisms having practically no weight, you decry that we shouldn't get our hopes up, and the flocks of sheep who read this with a giggling approval concur.

But the truth is much harder to deal with. It IS a good game. We SHOULD be excited. There are things which are ACTUALLY revolutionary.

Posted: Jun 18th 2010 10:22PM Seraphina Brennan said

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Mr. Higashi,

I think you misunderstand me. I said I liked the game overall, but I didn't find it to be as revolutionary as some people are making it out to be. I also said that I was confused as to why the hit animation was triggering while in stealth. I'm not confused about taking damage, I'm confused as to why I'm still pulsing like I'm getting shot in the ass while standing behind a huge wall. And I'm certain that it's something that's going to be worked out. I'm certainly not against the smuggler taking damage while in cover... it's there to bolster the smuggler's armor, not prevent damage. I'm against laser fire homing in through walls and still literally shooting the smuggler through a wall. Have the animation change to properly reflect what's going on.

You're looking for a "good or bad" scenario here. Or perhaps you think that since I said "it's a good MMO with gold plating" I mean it's a bad game. That's not the case at all. Even amazing games have bad spots. Look at Red Dead Redemption's notorious bugs. Yet, all of those are overridden by the experience that RDR provides.

And, lastly, the rogue operates by utilizing generated energy to execute painful attacks while operating from a secondary state (stealth). A smuggler operates by... utilizing generated energy to execute painful distance attacks from a secondary state (cover). They are founded on the same principles, whether you agree with me or not. Sure, cover is not exactly equal to stealth, but it leads to the same outcome with the same basic gameplay concept driving it.

So, in short, I think you're misunderstanding me and attacking me for simply not completely enjoying the experience. But, what you're missing is that while I didn't enjoy part of the experience, there were parts where I really enjoyed it. Isn't that enough?

~Sera
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Posted: Jun 18th 2010 9:35PM BubleFett said

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These aren't the mmos you are looking for.
You can go about your business. move along.


Posted: Jun 19th 2010 12:31AM karnisov said

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good one. lol
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Posted: Jun 18th 2010 11:35PM Kingshield said

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I get so tired of the comments screaming at people about stating that a game is a Wow-Clone. Yes, a lot of games utilize a similar set of mechanics but I don't think its logical to say that a game can't be a WOW-Clone because it, itself utilized systems from Everquest and etc. That logic doesn't hold water because Everquest was no where near as successful as WOW. Therefore, because WOW is so successful, calling games that attempt to garner their own success using it's mechanics clones, IS valid.

The systems used in WOW have enough originality to differ themselves from Everquest and other past MMOs. So either, WOW must stand alone as a Triple-A MMO title, or it's simply a clone of Everquest and previous MMOs.

You cannot have it both ways.

Posted: Jun 18th 2010 11:43PM (Unverified) said

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Sadly, while the reviewer was looking for, and apparently found, a "movie experience", my wallet is looking for a game. Nice to know hiring reject devs from SOE is paying off, now both major Star Wars mmos have NPCs shooting through walls.

Posted: Jun 19th 2010 12:27AM karnisov said

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"So, in short, don't get yourself super hyped about this game. It's not amazingly innovative or a complete genre changer. It's not re-inventing the wheel, but it is taking that wheel and giving it the gold plating it needs."

thx for the honest and objective opinion sera, i will probably spectate this one from the comfort of my space RV while sipping a corellian brew. lol.

help us Richard Garriot (or Raph Koster). you're our only hope (for innovation in mmos).

Posted: Jun 19th 2010 12:51AM (Unverified) said

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Lol > "WoW Clone". WoW didn't innovate either, they just knew how to market. Everything in WoW has been taken from EQ, DAoC, and the plethora of other successful MMORPG's before it. The UI that you mistakenly think they "took" from WoW, WoW took from the other MMO's.

Were any of you around for WoW's launch? That wasn't flawless either; both their PvE and PvP endgame systems and most of their classes have done 180's with just about every expansion, if not more often than that.

Just because you've played WoW for 5 years, doesn't make you and MMO player. The vast majority of the MMO market started with WoW and have continued with it. You started playing WoW waaay after all the polish Blizz did with it, so when when a new game comes out and doesn't have the 6 years worth of polish WoW has, you immediately quit the game and call it a failure. Every MMO you die-hard WoW'ers accuse of "flopping" still have dedicated communities, loyal developers, and still make a profit. LotRO, AoC, Vanguard, WAR, and even the older ones EQ, EQ2, Asheron's Call, GW, DAoC, etc. still have all this.

I think even making these comparisons to WoW is making your "honest" review horribly bias. I don't hate WoW, I just think far too much judgement is made about games with reference to WoW, when WoW itself was never revolutionary.

Read this - http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=128252 - for an unbiased review of Blizzard if you're grown up enough to handle it.

Some of the points you made, comparing swtor to wow, are common to every MMO, that were released both before and after wow. Some are fundamental to the MMO genre; without having them is like an FPS that's third-person with swords - that's not an FPS anymore. Your article is full of fact, but the way you presented it really displays your personal opinion - and you're bias.

Posted: Jun 19th 2010 1:03AM (Unverified) said

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It would be enough if I thought you had substantive criticisms of the game. Your writing is usually much better caliber than this. Instead, you seem more focussed in this piece on refuting perceived claims of the game's excellence; attempting to temper some gushing fan boy outcry.

1. There's a pre-beta issue with combat animations?
2. The smuggler is too much like a rogue when described in overly generalized terms?
3. It's too much like an MMO?
4. Statistics on armor implies a gear grind?

These are not hard marks against the game. You claim to enjoy so much of the experience, you list reason upon reason to be excited, but then at the end, because of a few completely ridiculous criticisms you feel as though we should all take a step back and be like "yea, it's not THAT great."

It's snarky and pretentious and misguided. And as a true admirer of your work, I'm disappointed.

"So, in short, don't get yourself super hyped about this game." Is not the proper response for an "amazing game with bad spots." Especially when the bad spots are 1) Overwhelmingly likely to be fixed 2) A aesthetic judgement without foundation 3) Completely irrelevant 4) Conclusion does not follow.

Posted: Jun 19th 2010 2:49AM (Unverified) said

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Each person is attracted to a certain MMO,hence the huge niche of MMO's in the recent years so not every MMO will attract a great population of gamers i.e SWTOR will definitely attract SW fans and STO attracted Trekkies :)


I never depend on someone's review or POV of a game because i know i'll have a different perspective of that person,heck i'm still playing WAR since launch day and i have my hands on APB pre-order aswell! :)

Sera,nice review by the way!

And guys,stop comparing WoW with each MMO you see in the horizon you just because WoW was your first MMO experience.

Posted: Jun 19th 2010 3:28AM (Unverified) said

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Ok, you guys need to get something straight here. WoW dominates the market but did not create it.
WoW copied the EQ model, EQ copied the PnP model.

So the comparison we should be drawing on is "does this hold up as a proper RPG"? As these games are mmoRPG's not stat managers/level grinders/raid endgame driven (raids - created by SOE not an RP element) puke which is what our genre has devolved into.

Looking at all the parts I have seen so far I would have to say "yes" for the most part. The critical RPG element of "plot" on a character level is finally being addressed and they are attempting to bring MMO's to the standard of the rest of the PC gaming industry with full voice over.

Posted: Jun 19th 2010 1:13PM karnisov said

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actually EQ copied the MUD model, not PnP.
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Posted: Jun 19th 2010 5:47AM Pan1 said

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It is extremely sad to see how unique and individual opinions are not apreciated and greyed out.

Web 2.0?

You can have it.
As for the article, I wished it covered the pros and cons a bit better.
Do forgive me when I say that the trend of deflating the hype has been noticable.
The only thing I wonder about wether this was voluntary or requisted from Bioware.


Still, them graphics must change a lot ingame if they look so different from the screenshots.

Posted: Jun 19th 2010 8:06AM Tom in VA said

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"What's the oldest profession? If you answered smuggling, then you're wrong, but you're totally on track for what we're going to cover in today's hands-on!"

I lol'd at this. Sera, even when I disagree with you, I always very much appreciate your winsome flair for writing. :)

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