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Reader Comments (35)

Posted: Apr 8th 2010 12:25PM (Unverified) said

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"The big changes to the Might, Martial Arts, and Supernatural frameworks went live last weekend, "


Seriously what are you talking about? you must live in the future because none of the melee changes went live, in fact the patch is still in test server and (according to the devs) subject to any kind of correction the players may suggest!

Posted: Apr 8th 2010 12:35PM charlieromeobravo said

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I think he means on PTS...
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Posted: Apr 8th 2010 1:09PM wufiavelli said

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Wow darkfall has a more balanced skill system then this. They really should of went class based with a lot of visual customization but little effect on gameplay.

Posted: Apr 8th 2010 1:52PM (Unverified) said

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I've never played darkfall, but I disagree entirely with your claim that CO should of been class based. What, so everyone looks really different, but they all function the same? The Archery character works the same as the Munitions character? Fire works the same as Ice? MA:Dual Blades works the same as MA:Unarmed? Yeah, that sounds like loads of fun....
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Posted: Apr 8th 2010 12:50PM urgan said

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The problem was never with damage or energy generation, the problem was always with stuff running away, and it still does. No, lunging does not help.

Posted: Apr 8th 2010 1:21PM charlieromeobravo said

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Lunges are gaining a stun effect and a travel power removal advantage so, yeah, lunges would actually help with fleeing bad guys now.
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Posted: Apr 8th 2010 1:26PM urgan said

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Well it didn't help me on the test server, stuff still ran away. No, the only thing which marginally helped was the increased melee range.
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Posted: Apr 8th 2010 12:57PM Vundal said

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i think the fact that an mmo developer misses something so big as momentum, and not factoring it in their balancing, really shows the difference between Champions and WoW. Say what you will, but Blizzard knows how to balance thier classes and what each class should be good at.

In all honesty, its large mistakes like this that shows us that cryptic deserves its low subscription rate.- noone should be rewarded for shitty work.

Posted: Apr 8th 2010 1:22PM Halldorr said

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"Blizzard knows how to balance thier classes"

You lost me at that point, I strongly disagree. Maybe a little more balance in their PVE but their PVP balance is terrible.
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Posted: Apr 8th 2010 1:44PM (Unverified) said

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The difference between CO and WoW is NOT what you claim. The difference is simply this: CO lets you create your own character with whatever abilities you like, WoW makes you play as one of 10 premade characters with premade appearances. So what if Blizzard can balance "thier" classes, it isn't much of a feat when everyone uses one of 10 skillsets. You can predict what each class is doing.
I have to imagine that balancing a game with 20 powersets is alot harder to balance.

This is NOT a large mistake as everyone seems to believe. This is part of a test. What is so bad about making a mistake in a test?? If the patch was perfect and cleansed of all the bugs that have been brought up in this article, why would they have to test it in the first place?

In all honesty, it's large mistakes such as forcing people to play as a premade character that shows us that blizzard does not deserve its high subscription rate; noone should be rewarded for shitty character creation.
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Posted: Apr 8th 2010 1:48PM Nef said

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There's a pretty big difference between set classes and frameworks. These skills might be balanced in their framework, but if you add them to skills from other sets... it could be completely different.

Also, I happen to remember playing WoW at launch... didn't it take them a good year or two (or more) to get some of the classes (warlock and druid come to mind) up to 'par' with the others? They weren't perfect, either.
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Posted: Apr 8th 2010 3:16PM (Unverified) said

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@Nef: People tend to look at WoW's early days with rose colored glasses. I remember many times where there was massive imbalance between the classes, as well as the obnoxious queues very early on, broken dungeons, etc.
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Posted: Apr 8th 2010 1:21PM (Unverified) said

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I have to say though, I LOVE the new supernatural powers and updated effects. I'm so ready to start yet another character!

Posted: Apr 8th 2010 2:51PM (Unverified) said

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It seems odd to me that the author is going on about a patch that is still in the public test realm and has yet to be patched to live. Since it’s all on test those changes have yet to be implemented in the game.

I realize it’s an opinion piece but I’d still encourage the author to see what makes it onto the live server before posting an article that would probably be more at home on the PTR message board rather than an actual news site. If the changes make it to live and they suck, then complain.

Posted: Apr 8th 2010 3:19PM (Unverified) said

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AGREED! this was exactly my point in the first post .... what are we exaclty discussing here? a test? it seems pretty stupid to me since it will be subject to many changes before GOING LIVE FOR REAL!
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Posted: Apr 8th 2010 5:16PM Its Utakata stupid said

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I will also add:

"The controversy never seems to end in Champions Online. The big changes to the Might, Martial Arts, and Supernatural frameworks went live last weekend, and people just can't stop talking about them. There's also been some general changes to melee outside of those frameworks as well."

The opening paragrah reads that these changes already went live....when they have not. Unfortunately this inaccuracy creates confusion...if not a bit mis-leading. Perhaps, a better edit before releasing the article in question should suffice. It's bad enough reading the shenanigans over at Cryptic here without the authors fumbling the facts. :(
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Posted: Apr 8th 2010 2:41PM (Unverified) said

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Same crap from Cryptic different day. They simply don't understand that massive balancing changes shouldn't be done all at once. They should have been tweaking these powers and combinations from day one rather than putting in huge overarching changes. In this case, ripping the band aid off all at once is not a good idea.

If this is on test then they should be cut a lot of slack. In my experience with them, they put live whatever is on test despite user issues found on the test servers.

Posted: Apr 8th 2010 3:19PM Anatidae said

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Well, why not break things big on the PTS then bring them back in line. Then the players will say how great it was that Cryptic was listening on the horrible patch and how they fixed it. You could get in bigger changes that way than releasing a moderate patch. The problem with moderate patches is when you have to make something more dramatic, people complain even more (because they will complain anyway)

Go overboard, pull back, release. It just depends on if Cryptic will take the time to play lots of powersets and listen to the experiences closely.

Posted: Apr 8th 2010 3:46PM cray said

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So a group of people (Cryptic) working on a huge software (CHAMPIONS) and testing it out. The public sees something that was overlooked and screams "Mistake!"

I'm no fan of Cryptic, but I don't like the way this article implies wrongdoing by Cryptic. It's a test server and they are entitled to balance it however they like. Calling it 'spreadsheet balancing' is a disguised insult while throwing in a few compliments.

Quite frankly I don't think spreadsheet balancing is such a bad thing when you have as many skill sets as CHAMPIONS does. Laser Sword was altered, not nerfed as Patrick seems to be convinced so. He goes on to say the skill has increased damage and cost. That doesn't sound nerfed to me. He also doesn't consider why the trade off was made losing 'Momentum'. Laser Sword is a ranged melee skill that already had advantage of Swords as opposed to punch and kicking skills.

Basically this article boils down Patrick's favorite skill (Laser Sword) being supposedly nerfed. At the very least he admitted he is little sore about it.

Posted: Apr 8th 2010 5:35PM (Unverified) said

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Did you even read the post? It's like you have no idea what he's talking about, or what you're talking about, since I think it's fair to guess that you haven't played CO yourself. There are two very different powers he's talking about, and you're lumping them together into one entity, and drawing implications off of that which just aren't there. Reading comprehension FTW.
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