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Posted: Mar 21st 2010 8:24AM Miffy said

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For me I never join guilds because they never benefit me. I mean they always take too long to do anything and you always end up in PUGS any ways. Normally the guild takes a percentage of your money as well.

So for me I rather just PUG my way through the game.

Posted: Mar 21st 2010 8:33AM (Unverified) said

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Guild are called Corporations in EVE Online, and I can say they're one of the most important aspects of the game. The fact that you will always be in a corporation (if you leave your player-run corp, you'll automatically join an NPC corp) already indicates corps are very important to the gameplay, but the added fact that you cannot trust PUGs in EVE means that you need a group of players who are your friends and who you trust enough to go into low security space with them without them attacking you. In fact, you need to trust them enough to go into any space at all, since battles between corporation mates will not result in CONCORD intervention. Since all corporations in EVE are built upon trust much more than guilds in other games, the friendships are usually tighter. Next to that, many players together can afford what a single player usually cannot, namely capital ships and Player Owned Stations, they can overcome more difficult challenges like especially tricky L4 missions, and they can set common goals such as training for industrial ships such as the Hulk and the Orca, or battleships such as the Abaddon and the Dominix. Your corpmates are the perfect substitute for the almost non-existent in-game tutorial, and there's nothing better than chatting away in corp chat when you're on a particularly boring mining op.

Frankly, I have never played a game where guilds, or corporations, were as important as in EVE. You don't need them to play the game, but numbers do matter in EVE (one expensive battleship can be killed by 20 low-cost frigates) and it's always helpful if you have a corporation with friendly, helpful players supporting you.

Posted: Mar 21st 2010 1:38PM jlong64 said

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I have been playing with my guild, Lions of Judah, for some time now. We are a Christian based guild, so we don't see a lot of the "Bad Behavior" that you may see in many other guilds. We try very hard to exemplify the Christian beliefs in our gaming style/life as well as real life.

We have active chapters in several games, Eve, LOTRO, STO, and WOW. I would find it very hard to game without my guild.

Posted: Mar 21st 2010 9:40AM (Unverified) said

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To keep things brief, guilds are without a doubt the most important aspect of any game for me. Whether they directly benefit me from a gameplay standpoint or not, the people make the game, and if I have good, friendly people to enjoy the game alongside, then the game itself becomes exponentially more enjoyable for me. The people, put simply, are everything.

Posted: Mar 21st 2010 9:43AM Daelen said

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Guilds make or break MMOs. They will keep you playing a game you don't really enjoy anymore and have you leaving one you do but feel the lack of a good one is locking you out of content.

A lot of people just don't do the PUG thing, which is silly since your guild really is just a PUG. Count me into that group of silliness =)

Posted: Mar 21st 2010 9:56AM Valdamar said

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In EverQuest my guild was essential - realistically I couldn't do anything without their help because the later game was so focused on raiding or always having at least one full group with you. It was nice from a social perspective, but terrible from a gameplay perspective (I spent over half of my gaming time waiting for things to start or for people to arrive or travelling to where they were, or debating what to do).

In Planetside my Outfit/guild vastly improved my playing experience, but were not strictly essential to being able to play the game - a vastly improved situation over EverQuest. The game made it was easy to join them, wherever they were, and teamwork just made you so much more effective (rather than teams being the only way to play).

Every MMO I've played since (EQ2, CoH, DAoC, WoW, DDO, etc etc.) hasn't required me to be in a guild, and I think being in a big guild would only have vastly improved my play experience if I'd been raiding a lot (I didn't in those games) - so my guilds in those games have only had a few people in them, usually close friends of mine from before I started playing (either real life friends or ones from other MMOs) - but they've still been important to me.

A guild is very important, but I don't like MMOs that make being in a guild (or being in a guild of a certain size) almost mandatory - I prefer MMOs where being in a guild just improves your enjoyment of the game.

Posted: Mar 21st 2010 10:01AM Valdamar said

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Oh and I forgot to say that sometimes being in a guild can be a bad thing - I played EverQuest for at least a year longer than I actually enjoyed playing it, just because I felt responsibility/duty towards my raiding guild because I was guild/raid leader - I also saw lots of other people who just persisted through periods of MMO burnout cos they felt obligated to stay with the guild even though they no longer enjoyed the game, and it caused some bitterness/drama. That's why I prefer MMOs that give you compelling reasons to form guilds, but don't make it the preferred/only way to play the game.
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Posted: Mar 21st 2010 10:25AM (Unverified) said

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My guild is everything about the game to me.

MMOs are naturally very social games, they revolve around interacting with your fellow players, there's no avoiding it. Without a strong consistent team of peers to play with it's easy for me to lose interest in the game which is why i have issues getting into new MMOs.

I know most friends feel the same, some don't even realise it.

Posted: Mar 21st 2010 10:26AM Joshua Przygocki said

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I only like a guild if I become friends with the members, they include me in activities, and I can include them in mine, I've always enjoyed when a guild would take a little risk on a raid or something just to let me and some of the other "fresh" end-gamers get some loot. Or when they are willing to help out on a hard quest or dungeon, I also like being able to help them and include them in things, but most guilds tend to have a bunch of jerkoffs who just wanna force all the others to play a certain class or way because "the guild needs it."

Posted: Mar 21st 2010 11:36AM (Unverified) said

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I never join a guild until it would be of use to me and NEVER join "leveling guilds." Leveling is the time I get to know people on my server; why tie myself down to a small core of people during that time? Even once I decide it could be guild time for me, I refuse to just join any guild. I wait until a group of people demonstrate that they are organized and courteous before I join them (and before they ask me to join; I hate people who ask you to join a guild without knowing a thing about you).

Posted: Mar 21st 2010 11:42AM myr said

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I think it's less the guild, and more the people that the guild connects you to. I say this because my main social LS in FFXI has reformed a couple times over the years, but it's always been the same core group of people.

Would I play the game without them? Only for a while, probably. I actually did reroll on another server for a month when everyone else was taking a break, and started to make some new friends... but at this point there's a big, 7-year gap to fill without them. :(

Posted: Mar 21st 2010 11:49AM (Unverified) said

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I met my CoH supergroup about three years ago and they are now the one thing that keeps me subscribed, atleast until GR. Were they to quit the game I would definitely quit and go with them to whatever game they went to.

Posted: Mar 21st 2010 12:33PM Cinnamoon said

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Been in the same guild for my entire MMO life, not quite thirteen years. Some of the faces in it may change, but the core are wonderful, consistently true friends (and just as worthy IRL, I've found, when meeting them over the years). Sometimes I'll play a soloable MMO without them, or just with my husband, but I rarely last long without my mates. They make the game.

On the other hand, certain other people's guilds can also ruin a game for me. Guilds may be innately social, but that doesn't necessarily make all of them the positive, constructive kind of social.

Posted: Mar 21st 2010 12:36PM Rialle said

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I have perceived guilds as being incredibly rewarding and beneficial to all different types of players in most of the MMOs I've played. The odd exception to this is World of Warcraft.

Since WoW offers nothing of depth except for the raid game, the only point to a guild is raid organization. However, with the LFG tools and lack of other guild benefits, you are often better off PUGGING unless you are the type of player who can be in a truly competitive guild.

On most servers, there are 1-3 guilds that have enough skilled members to be considered competitive. (If your guild did not down the LK on 25-man normal before the Wrynn/Hellscream buff, your guild likely does not fall under this category.) The rest of the guilds just seem to be glorified PUGs with broken loot systems and mismanaged guild banks. Usually these guilds will consist of a few skilled players trying to keep the rest of the guild in line on raid nights. Often, getting 25-people online on time is challenge enough for many guilds.

Since other aspects of WoW (crafting/economy, social/RP, exploration, and PvP) are completely shallow, there is little real benefit to have a guild centered around those aspects. Ranked PvP falls under a different organization structure (Arena Teams) entirely.

Unsurprisingly, we see huge turnover in WoW guild membership, the likes of which I do not really see in other games. 99%+ of the guilds are just complete jokes, so there is no reason for players to stick with them when things go even a bit south in the guild. It seems all too often in a WoW guild there will be drama which culminates in the leader ninjaing the entire guild bank and then disappearing (read: transferring to a new server).

I think Blizzard recognizes this fact, which is probably why they are introducing "guild specs" in Cataclysm. If or not these will help benefit any guilds but the high end PvE progression guilds remains to be seen.

Posted: Mar 21st 2010 6:21PM (Unverified) said

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Rialle, I think you're understating the significance of the area in between "competitive guild" and "bunch of scrubs that might as well be a PUG". That's the space I've always played in in WoW - my guild has never been dedicated or hardcore enough to challenge for server firsts or anything, but we've stuck it out over the years.

Yes there's often a few skilled players trying to keep the rest of the guild in line on raid nights, and yes, often, getting 25-people online on time is challenge enough. But we've been raiding since MC, are currently 11/12 on ICC-10 and 8/12 on ICC-25, and our raids are infinitely smoother and more fun than any PUG any of us have seen.

But I do agree that it's mystifying that it has taken Blizzard this long to get to the point of fattening up the guild system to be more than a glorified chat channel. Some form of guild levelling, ranking, advancement, territory control, whatever, seems to be mandatory in a modern MMO.
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Posted: Mar 21st 2010 9:11PM Allegos said

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Rialle's experience with WoW guilds matches mine. I find that WoW's lack of depth works for me, though. I take a low maintenance city boy's approach to the game's social aspect. I don't need to be best friends with coworkers and customers. Part of what has kept me away from EVE, Warhammer, and Conan is the forced dependance I'd have on a guild in a more hostile environment.
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Posted: Mar 21st 2010 2:57PM Stormwaltz said

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I've never joined a guild that wasn't composed of people I already knew in real life. Fortunately, nearly everyone I know is a gamer. Our guilds are small, we get along great, we never have Guild Drama, and we don't recruit -- but it often comes to pass that as people drift off to other games, I'm left as a soloer in an empty space station office / kinhouse / secret villain headquarters.

Posted: Mar 21st 2010 6:06PM (Unverified) said

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In WoW, my guild is everything. It has reformed and renamed a few times, and is on a different server now to where we started, but there's a common thread running through from the guild I first formed with a workmate and some of his buddies back in 2004.

The main thing I'm into in WoW is raiding, and if my guild stops raiding (as it has done for a few periods over the years), I stop raiding too, and sometimes suspend my subscription. I just have no interest whatsoever in trying to get things going with a group of strangers rather than these friends I've been with for more than five years.

The other game I'm playing seriously at the moment is Atlantica Online. I got a guild invite out of the blue, and accepted it (because, amusingly enough, I had a quest on my quest log to "join or form a guild"). Anyway, they've turned out to be a fine bunch to hang out with, part of a large and active nation (alliance of guilds), and I'm really glad to have gotten the random invite from them. But it has only been a month or so, they're certainly not people I'm so close to yet as to call real friends.

Posted: Mar 21st 2010 9:27PM (Unverified) said

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Adding to the comment regarding EVE...

There is very much a "give and take" relationship between members and the Corp that is lacking in many other MMOs.

The fact that Corps can tax members gives an incentive for Corps to recruit, while players have access to Corp resources for activities other than "Kill the Raid Boss".

Moreover, the use of Corp Contracts and Corp Mail addresses allow members to communicate and cooperate without even having to be online at the same time!

Posted: Mar 23rd 2010 9:05PM Evy said

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My guild is a HUGE reason behind staying with WoW so long. They're an awesome group of folks. I'm not sure I would've stuck around this long without them. At this point, they're like family. My guildmaster and his wife were even at my wedding. :)

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