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Reader Comments (31)

Posted: Feb 4th 2009 8:19AM (Unverified) said

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Honestly, they're right on track. In a short time they're going to be adding in the remaining additional careers, add in a Darkness Falls equivalent, and release an actual trial program of the game (not just the buddy keys). The trial is a key part in getting new people to try and buy the game.

Posted: Feb 4th 2009 8:30AM (Unverified) said

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Yeah, because selling a million copies of a game, then less than 6 months later, having a third of those sales still active is "on track".

Uh huh. Sure.

Keep going Mythic. Keep polishing that turd. Throw all the new classes into the game you want, still won't make the fundamental game FUN.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2009 8:32AM UnSub said

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What people wanted of WAR was a heavily slanted PvP title with RvR at its core. What they got was a heavily grindy game focused on PvE, instanced PvP and an RvR design that actively discouraged participation.

Servers have been merged in all but official announcement. All this "free server transfers" have resulted in half the servers available at launch being virtually shut down (can no longer start new characters on them).

If they want to bring people back, make RvR the core of WAR (and this includes character advancement). Have it so the game engine can support large battles. Reduce the size of the world and the pain in running from one side to the other just to get to a warcamp where RvR might be a possibility. Encourage RvR / PvP battles with better loot than can be received through PvE. Do something to deal with population imbalance. Make it so the best tactic of winning a zone isn't to avoid actually fighting your opponents.

... but this won't happen. Mythic's glacial tweaking of WAR has seen 62.5% of their original subscriber numbers evaporate. Adding new areas? New classes? Band-aid solutions to a much bigger set of problems.

Posted: Feb 4th 2009 8:41AM (Unverified) said

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The best part about Warhammer is playing musical keeps! Stay away from the actual fighting if you want a decent flow of renown! Or bring 3 Warbands to stomp on 6 people!
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Posted: Feb 4th 2009 9:25AM Temploiter said

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Pretty much bang-on Unsub. "What people wanted of WAR was a heavily slanted PvP title with RvR at its core. What they got was a heavily grindy game focused on PvE, instanced PvP and an RvR design that actively discouraged participation."
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Posted: Feb 4th 2009 10:50AM Nadril said

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You said exactly what I wanted to say UnSub. All these new features are nice and all, but there are core mechanics that need to be fixed.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2009 8:38AM (Unverified) said

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Surprised? Nah I kind of chuckled and moved on.

Warhammer is a good game for what it is, it's just not my style. I never got into zerg vs. zerg style combat. Personally I like small scale pvp, 1v1, 5v5.

You know what really annoyed me about Warhammer? The freaking targetting system. The cursor doesn't select my opponent until I release the mouse button? Come on that's just lazy design.

Half the tactics for pretty much every class still not working? I'm willing to bet so. Oh well new classes!

Posted: Feb 4th 2009 9:22AM Greyjoy said

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Somewhere along the way companies lost the total ethos which embodies the core of what made MMORPG's so popular

PERSISTENCE

Instancing might make sense from a technological point of view but it just doesn't translate to a fun game.

Instance battlegrounds, no matter how you play it are just not fun for alot of people and persistent large PvP is (was)

That was the charm of DAoC, a large piece of land, aka EMAIN and tons of people running around getting into huge battles or smaller skirmishes on the fringe. It was constant, it was a small area and it made sense.

The current incarnation of WAR, seems to be so fragmented and detached that you question if you are actually playing a MMORPG or a new type of arcade game where you have a choice of PvE or PvP in this small compartmentalised sections of the game that you CHOOSE to enter

The battlegrounds access kills immersion that you are actually in a WAR, and the fact that they exist kills the emphasis on players to get stuck into RvR. How do you justify battlegrounds from a Lore point of view? I mean do they state you are teleported to a land to fight the opposition and continually have to go through the same thing over and over and over. It reeks of arcade game and coughs flem over the term Massive Multiplayer Online ROLEPLAYING Game

The charm of DAoC needs to be re-captured, and bolting on constant instances just kills that immersion and joy that PvP is suppose to bring.

I suggest a new title for these current slop of MMORPG's they should be call MMOAG, Massive Multiplayer Online Arcade Games, because lets be honest thats what they are.

I don't want to be one of those oldies harping back to the good old days of Ultima Online or Everquest, but those games really captured the charm of MMORPG's, making a fire in the middle of unknown land and killing animals to capture for food. The current games being created lose their subscribers because they provide quick short sharp bursts of excitement and then thats it, they can provide no more. There is no committment no dedication, no sense of loss, its just all handed to you on a plate and you grind away constantly to jump through the hoops provided

MMORPG's were a niche game, and alot of them do quite well with a smallish user base, Eve Online is a perfect example of a successful MMO that separated from the mould. It has a persistent online world that is constantly evolving and it doesn't over emphasise instancing so the immersion is not broken. WoW has caused publishing houses to drool over the potential money they can make, but the reality is that WoW did so well due to its existing franchises and the timing of its release, when no other true MMORPG's captured the hearts of people, and it was arguably the first truly 'easy' mmo

Until games developers and investors start taking the brave choice of investing in and creating MMO's that are challenging and differing then MMO's like WAR which are very much the same same like WoW with a couple of new bolt on's e.g. Public Quests. The genre is just going to go stale and eventually the WoW generation will get bored and move on.

I applaud games such as Atlantica Online and Eve who attempt to break this WoW mould and am appalled at games like Runes of Magic which just copy cat the genre into innovative bankruptcy

Posted: Feb 4th 2009 9:12AM foomchee said

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I played WOW with my girlfriend for over 2 years. I can't get her to touch this game and her favorite part of WOW was the PVP. Why... the lack of polish and buggy unfinished feel she got.

So the game is getting better but they still have a long way to go. I really enjoy Warhammer but I certainly can't argue with my girlfriend and convince her to give it another shot yet... its still not there.

Once Mythic releases the last 2 classes they need to go back and fix the exsisting ones, make sure all the abilities are working properly and look at class balance.

Then they need to merge servers to get the population up, keep tweeking orvr to make it more interesting, add a tier wide orvr chat channel. Add things like character dressing rooms and new item skins so when i upgrade my item i'm not wearing an identical item :/ Maybe take out some of the PQs, there are too damn many and I can never find a group for 1 let alone the 5-10 per zone......

Bah I'm at work and this list is far from finished. Basically I think they've got a fun game, Mythic just need to tie up all the loose ends A LOT.

Posted: Feb 4th 2009 9:19AM Drexel said

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I love how every game that doesn't fudge their Asian market subscriber numbers so they can say 12 million strong is instant epic fail in this community...they say 300k, and it's a "real" 300k...not 1 million in NA all with Recruit-a-Friend accounts so they can get a zebra and triple XP and 11 million hours of paid "accounts" in some Korean internet cafe.

You can't deny the success of WoW but the complete fudge job of their subscriber numbers has got to stop, it's destroying the MMO market for every game BUT WoW. Which leads to less variety and ultimately everyone loses.

I go back to the days of UO and EQ I when 250k+ would be considered and unbelievable blockbuster. I still think it's respectable for a game in relative it's infancy.

Posted: Feb 4th 2009 9:20AM Sephirah said

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300k it's not respectable if it cannot pay for development/maintenance costs.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2009 10:13AM (Unverified) said

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300k is not a respectable number when compared to other numbers (as stated in the article). They shipped 1.5 million units total, and have sold over 1 million. Having a small fraction of that as active subscribers is NOT a good sign.

This isn't about comparing numbers with the 800 pound gorilla. This is about comparing numbers with itself upon release, which wasn't so long ago.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2009 10:32AM Snow Leopard said

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300K is also not respectable if you sold 1 million copies at launch. That means alot of people have stopped playing your game in a relatively short amount of time.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2009 9:19AM Sephirah said

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IMO, you can have many subscriptions if you:

1.implement decently various aspects of the game: questing, instancing/raiding, PvP
2. have a good storyline/lore and interesting/various races/classes/zones/monsters
3. have few bugs and game balance issues

If you lack one of these aspect but are good on the others, you can still have your niche. If you lack two of them, people will try the game and leave soon.

Posted: Feb 4th 2009 9:30AM (Unverified) said

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I'm having fun, love WAR. Add few more large zone with PvE on all tiers. Keep up the bug fixes and new content. Keep the course Mythic and let the QQs leave to other MMOS to QQ there.

Posted: Feb 4th 2009 9:35AM (Unverified) said

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First poster told pretty much everything what I could say; they are on the right path. And honestly, who cares about WoW :) ?

Posted: Feb 4th 2009 10:14AM (Unverified) said

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11 million subscriptions care about WoW even though you may not.
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Posted: Feb 4th 2009 10:03AM Minofan said

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Well while an enjoyable PvE experience would be my personal ideal for changing WAR, it would take more time & resources than they can possible spare... so this is my list of more achievable suggestions to bolster what is already there :

1] Merge ! MERGE ! MERRRRGE !
WAR is already inexorably bound to "players as content", so they need to optimize this 'content' by fostering the highest population density that their servers can comfortably handle.

2] Allow scenario queuing in capitals.
Foster community by - you know - letting people congregate in the one communal area of each faction AND still play the game.
Not sure why this isn't enabled yet...

3] Spawn Ogre mercenary NPCs in to uneven PvP conflicts.
Prior to cancelling, I lost track of the number of WAR scenarios that pitched 12 (of the more populated realm) vs 7-9 (of the less populated realm) and resulted in a slow demoralising waste of time for all involved.
It goes without saying at this point that anyone who has played WAR ORvR knows that 90%+ of it involves masses of players obliterating a handful of NPCs guarding an ostensibly PvP control point.

My suggestion is that when unequal PvP engagements begin the underdogs should be supported by a spawning of friendly Ogres at key locations - who cannot capture and aren't worth victory points, but who do earn victory points for any casualties inflicted.
The number would be dynamically maintained, so Ogres would be reinforced as more of their realm drop out - or even more foes turn up - and dismissed as more of their realm arrive.
Since there is no indicator that WAR NPCs are capable of AI beyond utilising 1-2 basic skills, Ogres would be best represented as normal mammoth-HP Champion mobs and stay dead for a solid 30-45 seconds before respawning.

I am aware of the perversity of suggesting MORE NPCs as a means of bolstering PvP, but I really feel it would help a] introduce stronger competition and b] serve as a meaningful time buffer (as opposed to yet more meaningless clock watching) to allow opposition to mobilize.
I'd personally prioritize those aspects over PvP purism - surely it is better to raise the baseline from PvNobody to at least PvP+NPCs ?

4] More guild perks.
This would be a bigger picture change in the long-run, but right now there are a lot of simple perks that could be introduced to promote community and eliminate some significant irritations e.g. :

* Guild NPCs able to dye armor rare colors (the colors players ACTUALLY want).

* The ability to teleport to the guild 'hall' at guild rank 1 (coupled with queueing would promote capitals, creates a staging area for guild activities).

* Allow guild leaders to specify a single "guild war camp" for each tier, and give members an ability to teleport to the guild war camp of their tier (as determined by level) - this would seem a huge co-ordination boon and a dynamite way to give people means & motivation to care about ORvR.

Simply for the list of future priorities :
5] New armor & weapon skins.
WAR is (to my knowledge) the first mainstream MMO to hypothesize that players don't care what their character looks like, don't care that their character looks identical to other players & NPCs, yet will care about loot which is visually identical to what they already have/had always had - numbers so far suggest this is not proving to be a sound hypothesis.
Fix it.

Posted: Feb 4th 2009 10:12AM (Unverified) said

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Honestly, most of the comments that posters have made regarding changes that WAR needs to make......

Have been made, since launch. The bug fixes, the changes to the RvR system, they just implemented new flight masters to keep you from having to run so very far from zone to zone. And there is a tier wide RvR channel.

WAR is doing just fine. People forget what a buggy, screwed up, crappy game WoW was, immediately after launch. Go look up some old posts about WoW after launch, see if you recognize any of them. If you don't, you haven't really been part of a launch. WAR still has the chance to be the WoW-killer, I believe. It's not there yet, but the places that it's heading are magnificent.

Posted: Feb 4th 2009 10:17AM (Unverified) said

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The point of this article is the lack of subscriber numbers compared to the number of retail boxes shipped & sold.

WoW never EVER had that problem, even at it's worst. Subscribers have consistently increased since release.
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