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Reader Comments (18)

Posted: Oct 24th 2008 1:58PM (Unverified) said

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"Every class must be interesting, every class must be badass, and every class must be balanced. "

That's not Star Wars.

Balance Jedi with non-Jedi? Sure, balance them with Sith... but with Bounty Hunters? With Pirates/Smugglers/whatever? Unless players are meant to be playing sub-par Jedi, they should, at least at top levels, pwn non-Jedi/Sith.

"With the way that MMOs work, gaining and upgrading loot over levels, you're not going to end the game with the same lightsaber you started with. That might mean a succession of different lightsabers ..."

Again, not Star Wars.

'Trading up' lightsabers? That's just not on... Crafting a lightsaber is a Jedi's right of passage, and I can't think of any precedent in SW lore for Jedi to replace their lightsabers except when lost/broken.

Why rationalise this by saying it's 'the way that MMOs work?' Why not do something different?

"Yeah, our game is about loot. There are things in our game that as you progress you definitely can tell a new player from a high-level player."

Um, yeah, again, that's not Star Wars.

What, Obi-Wan and Yoda were obviously 'high-level' Jedi thanks to their uber-robes?

As much as I'd love an MMO set during the KotOR timeperiod, to quote Biscuit: "I'm troubled."

Posted: Oct 24th 2008 3:46PM (Unverified) said

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"Balance Jedi with non-Jedi? Sure, balance them with Sith... but with Bounty Hunters? With Pirates/Smugglers/whatever? Unless players are meant to be playing sub-par Jedi, they should, at least at top levels, pwn non-Jedi/Sith."

What's the betting that you played a Jedi in the NGE of SWG?

Balance is a lofty goal which is all too often missed by developers. That magical point where every class has its nemesis but has another class that 9/10 times they can destroy when properly played.

If you want a game where you can pick your class and go 'pwn everything in the face', go back to singleplayer games tbh.

Creating a game with a single class (regardless of faction differences) that can wipe the floor with every other class in the game makes the POINT of those other classes POINTLESS.

Any class when mastered should, in theory, have the ability to take on any other class and at least put on a respectable show.


...y'know what, I'll paraphrase for you:

If they'd have wanted to make a game where everyone played Jedi so they can go around one-shotting everything, they'd have made KoTOR 3.
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Posted: Oct 25th 2008 4:44PM (Unverified) said

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Star Wars *is* about loot. It's about having a ship that zips through the Kessel Run in less than 12 parsecs. It's about pod racers and cool speeders.

And balancing BH's against Jedi is fine. Think of the high level BH's all being "Boba Fetts". He eats Jedi for breakfast. And seriously Jedi have turned into a joke thx to the prequels and games like TFU.

What Star Wars is *NOT* about is moisture farmers and junk shop dealers. Note how they were always side characters that, to the overall story, were rather useless.

I'd much rather the development time be spent on story and adventuring over junk dealing. I mean, seriously? Goto a flea market.

There is so much whining about a game that isn't even out yet. When it drops, if you don't like it, DON'T PLAY IT.
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Posted: Oct 24th 2008 4:33PM Interitus said

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Wait so everyone is heroic? What if I want to play a support class? What if I want to be a Medic? If they have to make everyone a gun blazing bounty hunter or soldier to balance out the Jedi/Sith.. then I have no interest in playing.. I'll wait to see but so far there are more things I'm hearing that I don't like the sound ofthen things I do like the sound of.

Posted: Oct 24th 2008 2:14PM (Unverified) said

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Though I'm sure there will be two or three more articles after this one, I'm going to jump on this for a moment, since this article really hit an important cord with me. What Bioware has stated regarding a new approach to Crafting in TOR really just continues to validate my views that the folks at Bioware are about to set a new standard in MMO content. One of the things that always bothered me in my recently concluded WoW days was the method in which crafting was implemented. In truth, this really was the same with all MMOs that have garnered my attention for a time. What I always had a problem with was the fact that my Avatar was supposed to be a big, larger then life, heroic character pegged to save the world and given near unimaginable cosmic power in order to due so. (Pauses) And then he had to knit. I mean, really? I'm a Mage that can reshape the very foundations of the world, yet I need to break out the needle point in order to make some gear? Yeah, needless to say moments like that can take a person out of the "heroic" experience. Now, I am aware that I may be part of small party of people in regards to my opinions as I've known others who have absolutely loved everything that has to do with the crafting systems in multiple titles; none the less, it is my sincere hope that with TOR, should I wish to don a new set of Robes, my uber-Jedi will not be forced to break out the linen and course thread.

Posted: Oct 24th 2008 2:36PM distiler said

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Really depressing. I wonder wich is their target audience. Lame, very lame, both Lucas and Bioware.

We'll always have CCP for good virtual worlds like EvE Online.

Posted: Oct 24th 2008 3:50PM (Unverified) said

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I don't like the part about lightsabers.

However I do agree that it's ridiculous to think that the Jedi should be inherently better than everything else. There are many instances in SW lore that have non Jedi going toe to toe with Jedi. Jedi Masters are not as abundant as you would lead us to believe and someone who is truly elite and has worked all their life could definately give a Jedi Knight fits.

Posted: Oct 24th 2008 7:02PM Lateris said

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One thing I see that they are missing is the "fantasy" when a padawan has to build his first light saber. Without this story telling game play in game, Bioware will leave themselves wide open to be flamed. If they think they can be a wow killer they are going to have to release a perfect working product per lore and game play.

Posted: Oct 24th 2008 3:48PM Scopique said

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"We are going to have crafting, because that's a big part of MMOs."

"Yeah, our game is about loot."

Thanks, guys. You just killed it for me. They may be excited to be putting their hands on an MMO from the ground up, but do they realize that to the "jaded MMOer" phrases like these are repulsive? They're not selling points, they're selling-out points.

Posted: Oct 24th 2008 3:07PM (Unverified) said

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Guess what people? It's a game. As a game it has to incorporate gameplay that is interesting and engaging. That means you don't start out with jedis in brown robes that one-shot anything in the game and never get any better than that.

To say "that's not star wars" is just silly. Did you watch the movies? Was Luke Skywalker in Episode IV as powerful as in Episode VI? Was he wearing the same clothes, doing the same things? No. He'd progressed, he'd grown as a character and yes, technically, he'd gotten new gear.

Converting any movie franchise into a game, especially an RPG, requires making certain concessions. Deciding that this game is going to suck because classes are balanced instead of Jedi fitting YOUR perception is myopic.

Posted: Oct 24th 2008 3:57PM (Unverified) said

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Not everyone wants to be the uber hero! Everyone does however want to be the very best at their profession. Crafters should be great for sure, but they don't necessarily have to be great warriors to be satisfied crafting in the SW universe.

Merchants are an attractive class in any game for those that want power of a different kind - wealth = power to many.

Posted: Oct 24th 2008 4:12PM (Unverified) said

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I think the first post missed the mark and is a little to fan-boy freak out for this stage of development.

If you make Jedi's insane everyone will only play Jedi's and it won't be much fun.

It will be interesting if the go with the Tank, Healer, DPS format or they try something different.

Posted: Oct 24th 2008 9:52PM (Unverified) said

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Hey Hey

At this point I am very interested in how the sotry lines will be implemented. Maybe i am jaded or getting old but i am tired of the Power LvL grind, i am one of the people who used to press 1111111111, did the hardcore raid thing and sat with an spreed sheet. The fact that they are gonna try to implement a solid story that is unique to my class is well making me a happy camper.


I hope that the ability to bend the lore where it needs to be bent. As much as i would love to be the most power full Sith that can with a wave of his hand kill jedi's i am gonna assume the Jedi's that i just killed would most likly not be intirlly hapy with the game mechanics.

Welcome Home
Rev


Posted: Oct 24th 2008 10:43PM (Unverified) said

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Though it is not my intention to take on the aura of a forum troll, I can not help but jump onto this band wagon yet one more time. Though my previous post dealt solely with the question of Crafting, I have found the more prevalent responses far more interesting.

In my view, the idea of making the Jedi Class types far more superior to the others due to the belief that doing so would make the game more "Star Wars" is a problematic view, to say the least.

Now, I can understand a person taking that view who has only ever seen either the Original Trilogy or just the Saga as a whole, but one has to remember that TOR falls more in line with the SW Expanded Universe then just the films alone. And, for anyone who has dedicated thier time to reading the books, comics, and so on from the Zhan Trilogy all the way to Legacy knows that Jedi in the context of the EU are far from being beyond the destroying touch of enemy Bounty Hunters, Smugglers, Droids, etc.

To cover one last point, one must also recognize the fact that not "just" Star Wars fans will be playing TOR, and for any MMO to be succesful a form of balance must be maintained. Look at every MMO that has failed, in almost every instance that failure has been in large part to a sense of unfair play between the class types. AoC is the most recent example of this. WoW has proven that a succesful handling of Class balance is one of many keys to an MMO's great success, and if TOR is to share in that success, or even top it, being able to have your Droid Bounty Hunter knock off a Jedi in PvP or PvE is a must.

Posted: Oct 30th 2008 7:05AM (Unverified) said

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I'm fine with loot. But I don't want to see "Selling Exar Kun's Lightsaber PST" That would quickly end the game for me. On the other hand if you had some sort of upgrading system for your lightsaber (like in KotoR) Crystals, maybe emitter, etc, etc.

Best way to explain how Jedi aren't IMBA in this game is your a jedi with marginal talent. Aka your not from the Skywalker linage.

Posted: Oct 25th 2008 6:57AM (Unverified) said

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The thing about forcing "Heroic" status is that not everyone wants to be a part of the epic struggle. Some players just want to "live" in this universe getting on with their day to day lives and immersing themselves in everything that's happening around them. Typically these players will choose to be crafters, town mayors, traders, etc. I really hope that bioware isn't going to alienate these players by forcing them into the frontline when all they want to do is run their shops, build their towns, make their money and generally get on with being the backbone of the community.

Hero's come and go, but players who have built up a good business or created their own player town will nearly always be in it for the long term.

As for myself, I just want to be a Bounty Hunter and kill arogant Jedi. Counting on the support of long term community crafters to kit me out with the best weapons, armour and items is a big part of that.

In fact, if everyone is going to be running around twirling glowsticks from level 1, let's see them huntable by BH from level 20, that should give people some incentive to play a non-jedi class. Should be the rule with any SW related game. If you play a Jedi, people will try to kill you. lots.

Posted: Oct 27th 2008 6:50PM (Unverified) said

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"You know, crafting at its heart is not really what the universe is about. But one of the designers came up with a great idea, which I can't talk about because it's not implemented yet, of how to incorporate crafting into Star Wars without forcing a hero to do something that's very non-heroic."

I do not want to be a Hero!

The heroic storyline is for offline games not online. A server filled with hero's??? Isn't that a bit like too many chiefs, not enough Indians?

Posted: Oct 28th 2008 3:18PM (Unverified) said

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I have an idea. Make the character companion the one who does the crafting. That way, your character can be the hero, and your lackey can do the mundane work.

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